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[Clansgian AT wmconnect.com]

(Bev)
>  I would protest anyone else's right
> to continue to puff on...personal liberty and all that jazz.
> 

Smokers have become the modern day lepers, a shunned and pitied sub-culture.  
At one, and easily within memory, close to 90% of adults were smokers.  Now 
some estimates put it as low as 15%.  (You will find the range reported as a 
much smaller swing by some sources, as little as 60% down to 30% but memory 
and 
observation makes me think the former is more correct).

As others have pointed out the majority now has become weary of the rudeness. 
 In Georgia as now in Tennessee the dire predicitons that bars and 
restaurants would all go by the wayside proved to be false.  A friend of mine 
ran a 
Hampton Inn in Abingdon, Va near here.  It has 66 rooms and only six were 
designated as smoking rooms.  No one wanted them.  Night after night they 
were vacant 
while potential guests went elsewhere to find stinch-free rooms.  So the inn 
reduced it to three (and hired me to repaint the old ones.  They also had to 
replace the carpet, drapes, and all the furniture).  Still no one wanted the 
three remaining ones so those were converted too.  She reported that very, 
very 
occasionally an irate potential guest would go into a fit, but it happened so 
rarely that providing a place for tobacco addicts was not economically 
feasible.

But as to the 'freedom' angle.  A few years ago I became active in the local 
Libertarian Party before I determined that they were to a person delusional 
nut cases.  Nothing wrong with the platform and philosophy, but the memebers 
are 
by and large useless wastrels that couldn't organize a ham sandwich.  We met 
at the local Logan's Roadhouse (chain like Outback, Bennigans, Ruby 
Tuesday's, 
etc. whatever you have in your area) and those of us having dinner would be 
faced with the addicts lighting up in our faces (this was before Tennessee's 
comprehenive smoking ban).  Any hint at protest was met with the Libertarian 
mantara, "My freedom!  Freedom to smoke!"   

Fine.  Next meeting I had a chef's salad for supper and when the ususal 
suspects were gathered around, I pulled out a pint jar of some cheese we'd 
made 
which was suppsed to be Stilton (stinky enough in its own right) but had gone 
way 
beyond the Limberger stage.  As you cheese aficionados know, such stinky 
cheesses only stink, that don't taste that way.  But this cheese was 
magnificient 
in its reek!

Those sitting close to me, some with cigarettes in hand, truned green and 
asked me to remove the souce of the stinch.  "My freedom,freedom to eat 
cheese."  
When they got up to move away,  I followed them and put even more cheese on 
the salad.

Someone else at another Libertarian meeting pulled the same stunt by not 
bathing for a week.  Let's see just how much you stand by your 'freedom to 
reek' 
stand!!

>Gene, if I may, why do you only spend summers at Heartwood?  It seems
>odd that someone who writes a book about how to find the ideal country
>home and has a website called ruralize.com lives in the city in Arizona,
>especially when Heartwood is so beautiful, invigorating and potentially
>sustainable(not to mention the ideal country home)?  I'm sure you have a
>good reason, but it just seems like a non-sequitur to me.

Ounch!  And touche.   Not that yours is the only mind this has crossed.


James

> And driving isn't mandatory-licenses are still considered a
> privilege-and so much of our taxes go for public transit. Most people
> live in cities where there is a Walmart less than 5 minutes away.
> People should carpool, walk, or ride a bike.  I do.  Ron and I take one
> vehicle everyday.  And even if they do drive, that doesn't give them a
> right to break the law and speed.  Speeding is an abuse of the
> privilege, and you know I have the high ground on that argument just as
> you have the high ground on whether or not smoking is right or wrong.  I
> can give you a bunch of reasons why its wrong, excessive gasoline
> consumption amongst them.  Smoking and speeding are optional.  Both are
> not good, one is illegal and one is socially unacceptable.
> 
> 
> > Well, the Prez is the leader of his party and they all kow-tow to
> > him. And he does own the bully pulpit. Like God, all good things are
> >  attributed to his greatness. Unlike God, he also gets credit for a
> > lot of the bad stuff. It goes with the territory.
> 
> Yup.  Hey, do you get dictionary.com's word of the day?  Kowtow was the
> featured word last week.  It's Chinese in origin, did you know that?
> It's what you do before the Supreme One-prostrate yourself...lol..seriously.
> 
> 
> > Well, I am fully in favor of maximal personal freedom. Where it hits
> > a bump is when the freedom that A exercises impedes on B's rights. I
> >  would downgrade any leader who led his people down an unhealthy
> > path.
> 
> Look again at your "bump".
> We are an interconnected world.  Chaos theory..the butterfly
> effect...whatever you call it...we are connected..so no matter what I do
> or don't do, it affects you in some way.
> In the news today, I read that Arab leaders want the Netherlands and
> other countries to make laws to prevent insults to religions.
> The thought occurred to me that I am offended every time I see a woman
> in a burqa, it is a symbol of oppression for me.  It's insulting to me
> as a woman.  Why can't people see that even the things they take for
> granted as normal can be offensive to someone else?
> 
> 
>   I've always had a
> >> fondness for smokers in my heart, since I was one for so long...he
> >> would be THE perfect champion for an individual's right to smoke,
> >> or toke, or whatever. :)  Barack IS the new and improved Marlboro
> >> Man...lol..
> > 
> > Bev, your bias is loud and clear. We got it. Smoking kills people. It
> >  kills their lungs and it weakens their immune system so they get
> > sick from other problems more easily. You are manifesting the highly
> >  intelligent human who subverts their intelligence to their emotions
> > on a serious matter.
> 
> And you aren't biased?  Let's change the word smoking to
> beerdrinking....see?
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> > Methinks the South doth protest too much. Probably guilty
> > consciences. Pretty declasse to put down people who take health
> > seriously, don't you think?
> 
> No.
> It's declasse to be critical of smokers when one disregards their own
> health by beerdrinking or speeding or something-no, wait, that would be
> hypocritical, not declasse. <eg>
> 
> 
> 
> Bev
> 
> 
> -- 
> BevanRon of EarthNSky Farm   NW Georgia USDA Zone 7
> 34.498N    85.076W       Bev is Earth, Ron is Sky                    
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