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[rayzentz AT aim.com]

on this we agree. This gets back to being good stewards.






Dr. Raymond Zentz
 
It is better to die a free man, than to live, a slave.



-----Original Message-----
From: Lynda <lurine AT com-pair.net>
To: homestead AT lists.ibiblio.org
Sent: Sun, Nov 29, 2009 12:38 pm
Subject: Re: [Homestead] Climate-Gate


Here's how I see it.  We have the regulations in place and they are ignored. 
hen laws are passed, there is a long lead time until they become chiseled 
n stone.  Companies have, in some cases, up to 15 years to do the work to 
eet the regulations.  They don't do the work and then when the deadline 
omes around they cry about the cost.  HELLO!  If they had done the 
pdating, etc. whent he regulations came out, the cost would have been 
inimal.
Second, stop corporate welfare and tax breaks for companies who take their 
lants off shore.  You don't hold a whip over someone's head and then use it 
o feed them the carrots.  Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  I mean, if 
our kid doesn't do his homework and cheats on a test, do you reward him by 
iving him a raise in his allowance?
Louisiana-Pacific had a pulp mill in Humboldt County.  It would have cost 
hem somewhere around $250,000 to clean up the plant and go dioxin free when 
hey were first sued by Surf Riders.  They futz, they stalled, they fought 
t in court and they eventually lost.  Their legal bill was somewhere in the 
eighborhood of $10 million dollars and it cost $5 million to build the 
ipeline and convert to bleach free pulp.  $250,000 vs. $15 million and then 
hey cry about what it cost them.
Try tallying up the cost of building new plants and so forth and so on when 
ou move your plants off-shore vs. simply updating here in the U.S.  WHEN 
he regs first came out.
Sorry, the companies are slick AND dirty and the politicians are stupid and 
orrupt!  I have no sympathy for either!  ENFORCE the laws we already have! 
ND, the same applies to immigration!  Sanctuary cities need to loose ALL 
ederal funding!  They are breaking the law.
Now, just for the sake of accuracy, Gore doesn't own the company that sells 
he energy credits.  He owns stock in a company that bought stock in a 
ompany that does energy credits.  And I've already ranted about cutting 
0-90% of the farm subsidies because they don't go to *real* farms but only 
o corporate headquarters of agri-business.
Lynda
-"I'm fascinated by the hard line you're drawing over religion -- It gets
sed too much, as an excuse, a fall guy, a weapon, a con.  A lot of people,
aybe most, don't mean it except when it suits them."  Dallas
---- Original Message ----- 
rom: <DSanner106 AT aol.com>

 Good point, and this is why we do need to add to our regulations on
 emissions.
 but we need to do so in a more intelligent fashion.
 The end result of our efforts, have been to drive manufacturing out of 
 the
 United States and into third world countries that have NO such regulations
 and
 are polluting at incredible rates. Do we feel better about ourselves if 
 our
 own
 hands are not dirty but our neighbors are? Is hiring someone else to 
 commit
 a
 murder for you better than doing it yourself? We share the same air and
 water with
 the rest of the planet and need to look at the bigger picture when we
 create our
 regulations.

 A tiny fraction of the scamulous money we are just handing out willy 
 nilly
 would have re-tooled every auto plant in America to produce cleaner, more
 efficient
 cars. I doubt we will ever see the money Chrysler got again, and a lesser
 amount would
 have retooled everyone. At least we would have gotten something lasting 
 for
 our money.
 We cannot fool ourselves into thinking any politician has our back on this
 issue. Creation
 of taxes to address this problem will just lead to more political greed 
 and
 payoffs, but no
 actual solution to the problem. We should have put our money into fixing
 the problem
 rather than relying entirely on the factory owners to absorb the costs. We
 have lost millions
 of jobs and have not helped the environment one iota.

 The top politician, put up as an expert on this topic is Al Gore. Obama 
 has
 stated that he
 is his go to guy on these issues. Gore himself still flies around in the
 least efficient private jet
 in the skies, (you would think after he got the bad press he would have
 sold it) bought one
 clean car but has never been seen in anything other than SUV's. He accepts
 tobacco
 subsidies intended for poor farmers, to not grow tobacco on his family 
 land
 (As if he would take
 up farming tobacco if the money were cut off) and on that same land
 operates a mining
 operation with heavy pollution. He just built a massive indoor pool that
 draws more energy than
 12 houses just to heat it. He says all this is OK though because he buys
 "carbon credits" from
 a company he owns part of. He shifts money from his left pocket to his
 right pocket in other words.
 So he can live as wastefully as anyone we know, but preach to us
 about how we live. He wants new taxes on us as a punishment for our
 wasteful lives, that will
 hurt the poor far more than the wealthy. He left office worth less than a
 half million dollars and
 is worth over 200 million today, just a few years later. Where did the
 sudden massive wealth come
 from? Not his book, and certainly not his documentary he was supposed to
 donate any proceeds from,
 so where did he get it? Certainly not from corporations he is promoting 
 the
 agenda of, right? This
 is where our trust is placed? This guy will instruct the President? We are
 in trouble.
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