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  • From: "Lynda" <lurine AT com-pair.net>
  • To: <homestead AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [Homestead] Climate-Gate
  • Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:40:40 -0800

Just take away all the tax credits from the agri-business beef ranches, stop the give away BLM land leases and stop the corporate welfare to agri-business dairy farms and you'll cure the methane problem. Hey, and save millions a year in tax $$! Wow, if we stop corporate welfare we could pay for healthcare for everyone in the U.S. on the dollars sent to them each year!

Lynda
--"I'm fascinated by the hard line you're drawing over religion -- It gets
used too much, as an excuse, a fall guy, a weapon, a con. A lot of people,
maybe most, don't mean it except when it suits them." Dallas
----- Original Message ----- From: <DSanner106 AT aol.com>


Well said Bev.
Sometimes I think we are all way too arrogant to assume we
have the power to change the planet with our little everyday
activities. Before you know it, we will be installing mufflers on all
the cattle to mediate emissions

Drew



In a message dated 11/29/2009 2:58:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
erthnsky AT bellsouth.net writes:

All very true, but only part of the picture...
In fairness, these estimates of emissions are based on recent(historical
time) eruptions, all of which are regular type, land based eruptions.
There have been periods of time in Earth's history when the planet was
far more volcanically active. Most of the planet's volcanism actually
takes place underwater and the gas emissions become dissolved in the
ocean and released later. This also doesn't even take into account the
effect of super eruptions of VEI 8. When Toba blew up 75,000 years ago,
it created a mini ice age lasting 1000 years. That's climate change,
sure, but even that wasn't irreversible! The only way that mankind could
do such is global thermonuclear war(MAD), I would think, and even that
is questionable if you consider how quickly(relatively) the areas around
Chernobyl and Mount St. Helens are recovering.

Looking at Huckleberry Ridge in the Yellowstone caldera will make anyone
think twice about the effect of Volcanism on the environment. I can't
even imagine an eruption that large, yet they have happened many times
in Earth's history, and if you are talking about climate change, and the
reasons for it, then you have to look at the entire history-billions of
years, not just the last couple of centuries. I'm not saying that
mankind is not contributing to change, but I think we need to look at
the big picture and understand solar cycles, the effect of core
convection currents, the(relatively) nearby passing of extrasolar
objects and or large comets, the effects of extraterrestrial impacts,
etc. etc. When I was a kid, we had no idea that a massive ice sheet
meltoff over land could cause the ocean's salinity fueled current
conveyor belt to change or stop. That alone can affect climate change.

Finally, lets assume that it is proven that mankind is causing the
climate changes we are currently observing, and that we are in fact
hastening our own demise. So what? I am not so arrogant to think that I
deserve to live here---I personally think that Gaia will prevail and
undo any damage we do, over time, even if that means wiping us off the
face of the earth with viruses or extreme temperature change. Once we
are gone, or at least until our numbers are immensely decreased, then
Gaia will begin the healing process. Maybe new bacteria or viruses will
evolve to degrade our traces. Over time, even our contaminated nuclear
rods will be reabsorbed and molten into the center of the planet(crustal
recycling).

The bottom line is that the Earth is changing all on her own. At first,
she was a molten red glob, then a water world, then a white snowball,
and now it is both green and blue. There are lots of reasons for these
changes that do not involve humanity. Do we really think we can alter
the course of Earth's natural processes?

Bev
ps..my apologies for offending anyone who believe in a young Earth


Gerald Brittell wrote:
On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 11:10 PM, <rayzentz AT aim.com> wrote:

(snip).....Now, this isn't to say we can't do a better job of
stewardship. We can, and should. However, when Mount Pinotubo (sic)
spews forth more greenhouse gases in a single eruption than mankind
has in his entire history, ......


Dr. Ray,

The U.S. Geological survey estimates that the CO2 emissions from the
eruption of Mt. Pinatubo as 42 Mt (million tons). The total CO2 from
all volcanic activity worldwide is about 130 Mt per year. Emissions
from human activity from the U.S. alone are about 6 Gt (billion
tons).

or this:

Gerlach (1991) estimated a total global release of 3-4 x 10E12 mol/yr
from volcanoes. While this is a conservative estimate, man-made
(anthropogenic) CO2 emissions overwhelm this estimate by at least 150
times." http://volcano.oregonstate.edu/education/gases/man.html

Where in the world did you get this idea?
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--
Sleep well tonight, for somewhere in the ocean's depths, MY son is
protecting your freedom on the USS Key West, currently deployed
somewhere in the Pacific and/or Indian Ocean. Go Navy!
EarthNSky Farm, NW Georgia, USA


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