permaculture

[Woody Wodraska <wodraska@mac.com>]

I hear you Margaret and well said but we must not get depressed rather  
metabolize our grief into beauty and love the ground beneath our feet.
One thing for sure is that there is no shortage of work for  us to do  
and the sweet thing is that the spiritual worlds(also in trouble) are  
happy to help out.
We are definitely gonna pull out of this morass with all the conscious  
agriculture techniques and principles available to us and we are going  
to have a great time
doing it!
Bright Blessings,
Barbara and Woody
Woody Wodraska
wodraska@mac.com
http://www.soulmedicinejourney.com
    Deep Gardening: Soul Lessons from 17 Gardens, Biodynamic  
Memories  now available at http://www.trafford.com/Bookstore/BookDetail.aspx?BookId=SKU-000138866



On Aug 26, 2010, at 9:50 AM, Steven & Margaret Eisenhauer wrote:

> I agree that my statement that Boomers are sell outs is a gross
> generalization and for that I stand corrected.
> I am at the tail end of the boomer wave and have interacted with my  
> peers my
> entire life (Boomers), as a business person, artist/designer and a  
> farmer.
> I have witnessed the destruction of civil society, the loss of  
> culture and
> the rank lies that have constructed the current gestalt we live in  
> here in
> the USA.  I have seen one war after another that has led me to  
> believe that
> we are in endless wars for profit.  I have witnessed the loss of our
> nation's physical health due to a policy of food as a weapon and
> unbelievable greed (value added anyone?).  I have witnessed my  
> nation become
> a gulag much like the police state we were told to fear in the old  
> Soviet
> Union.  I have had success and been punished for it by those that  
> wish to
> maintain a corrupt status quo.  I also am aware that many Americans  
> are
> dependent on prescription drugs in order to deal with the morass  
> that we now
> find ourselves in. I also bear no ill will towards boomers, just a
> resounding sadness for where we find ourselves now and the resolve  
> to not
> put any of my pennies in the wrong cups.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Jacque
> Greenleaf
> Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 9:25 PM
> To: permaculture
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] Nicholas permaculture generation gap
>
> This is a gross overgeneralization.
>
> First of all, most boomers were not countercultural. I graduated  
> from a
> fairly large high school in 1965, and I would bet that the wildest  
> things
> most of my classmates ever dreamed of doing was smoke a joint or two  
> (and
> then spend years hiding that fact from their kids) and have sex before
> marriage. To be fair, that was indeed extremely wild, if you were  
> the child
> of midwestern or southern depression babies, believe me. Families  
> fractured
> permanently over these actions.
>
> For the minority of us who were genuinely countercultural, we thought
> changing the world completely would only take a decade or so. Wrong  
> then,
> and still wrong.
>
> I personally have never stopped working for the values I espoused  
> when I was
> young. I was a huge disappointment to my right-wing mother until the  
> day she
> died. It didn't stop me.
>
> I'm really curious, what experience have you had with people my age  
> that has
> led you to be so sour and judgmental?
>
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 25, 2010, at 5:11 PM, Steven & Margaret Eisenhauer wrote:
>
> > Boomers sold out.  They did not demand the kind of change they really
> wanted
> > and settled for the status Que. As a reward they have been ripped  
> > off and
> > side lined, ultimately settling for rank materialism and  
> > prescription feel
> > good drugs.  The boomers should get off the couch, get their heads  
> > out of
> > their behinds and work for the values they espoused as young  
> > people. Or
> > perhaps they can't remember what it was they wanted.  Or have the  
> > real
> > visionaries been liquidated? Have the rats ate the grain and all  
> > that is
> > left is the chaff?
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> > [mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Rain  
> > Tenaqiya
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 2:15 PM
> > To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: [permaculture] Nicholas permaculture generation gap
> >
> > Thanks, Nicholas, for one of the more thoughtful and solution-focused
> > messages of late.  I have been thinking about the generational  
> > differences
> > between Boomers and younger folks, especially as they relate to
> permaculture
> > efforts, and I do feel they are significant.  I largely agree with  
> > your
> > analysis, however I feel there is one important aspect that you  
> > left out.
> > Boomers may have had it easier in some ways, but many were truly
> > hard-working pioneers in other ways, creating options for later
> > generations.  We now have easy access to vegetarian and vegan food,
> > renewable energy, ecobuilding techniques, community land ownership  
> > models,
> > permaculture design, etc.  Many also worked harder than I think most
> younger
> > folks are willing to work.  The stories I have read and listened to  
> > about
> > the original back-to-the-landers make me feel like a wimp.  The  
> > current
> > generation has a sense of entitlement and an expectation that things
> should
> > be easy.  They are
> > also even more alienated from physical labor.  I speak from personal
> > experience.  Younger people also have more educational,  
> > entertainment, and
> > other opportunities and the society is more mobile, so it is hard  
> > to get
> > younger folks to commit to a place or project.  Whole segments of  
> > society
> > seem adrift.
> >
> > Your comment about rent-seeking retirees seems right on, however.   
> > I feel
> > too many otherwise progressive folks too easily accept the idea  
> > that it is
> > okay to take money you didn't earn yourself.  The lack of  
> > questioning of
> the
> > capitalist, class-based system makes me squirm.  On the other hand, I
> cringe
> > when I see how few of my well-intentioned friends have means to  
> > create
> > sustainable systems without using the property they have access to to
> > generate money through renting it out.  We need to come up with  
> > more ways
> to
> > raise immediate funds while still giving equity to those paying  
> > "rent."
> >
> >
> > Rain
> >
> >
> >
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