North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[<dmnorton@royaloakfarmorchard.com>]

We are a small batch facility....400 gallons to the batch.   We use do use 
drops from time to time.  All of our apples are sanitized before packing or 
using for cider and we pasteurize our cider, plus wash our sealed room cider 
mill with bleach between each batch, so we have no e-coli issues.  Anyone 
who serves cider to the public and does not use sanitation procedures is 
asking for a problem!

Dennis Norton
Royal Oak Farm Orchard
http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.com
http://www.theorchardkeeper.blogspot.com
http://www.revivalhymn.com
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Thomas Olenio" <tolenio@sentex.net>
To: "'North American Fruit Explorers'" <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] more E.coli


> Hello,
>
> Small batch facilities will take all comers.  They ask no questions and 
> all
> you need is one contaminated apple to get into production and it effects 
> all
> batches run that day.  The whole facility is NOT washed between customer
> batches.  I have been in a number of them in Ontario.
>
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Naomi
> Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 4:05 PM
> To: 'North American Fruit Explorers'
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] more E.coli
>
> Or a chicken coop.. ya know which hole the eggs come outta?
>
> Free ranging chickens and turkeys can be a self terminating venture..dogs,
> foxes, skunks.. It is better to coop them at night unless your trees are
> really big.
>
> I thought it was no longer permitterd to make commercial cider out of 
> drops.
> Naomi
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Olenio
> Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 1:38 PM
> To: 'North American Fruit Explorers'
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] more E.coli
>
> Hi Gordon,
>
> Turkeys and chickens roost in trees.
>
> Cider is made from drops.
>
> Don't feel bad, city folk do not know these things, while I have no idea
> what alley or part of the city to avoid.
>
> Most city folk would never drink milk again after spending five minutes in 
> a
> dairy barn.
>
> Later,
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:nafex-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Lucky Pittman
> Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 12:27 PM
> To: North American Fruit Explorers
> Subject: [NAFEX] more E.coli
>
> At 10:56 AM 12/12/2007, Gordon wrote:
>
> > I, for one, fail to see how cows, turkeys, or even humans defecating
> > in an orchard would damage the fruit unless the fruit was allowed to
> > fall on the ground.  Even then they could be sanatarily washed off
> > so that no danger would exist.
>
> That's the point - dropped apples.  There have been several oubreaks
> of hemorrhagic enterocolitis and HUS due to E.coli O157/H7, traced
> back to unpasteurized apple cider made from or including dropped
> apples that were picked up and pressed without being washed/brushed
> to remove surface contaminants.
> I was fairly certain that in at least one of those(I was thinking it
> was a CT outbreak, back in the early '90s), they isolated O157/H7
> from some deer fecal pellets they collected in the orchard - but I
> can't find documentation in a quick Google search.
> But, subsequent to those outbreaks, CDC has issued guidelines
> recommending that cider processors wash & brush dropped fruits, and
> some additional work has been done incorporating sodium benzoate into
> the wash/rinse water, as well.
>
> Contaminated, damaged apples can support the growth of E.coli
> O157/H7, and fruit flies can carry it from contaminated wounds to
> uncontaminated wounds.
> http://aem.asm.org/cgi/content/full/65/1/1
>
> Lucky
>
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