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  • From: "Tradingpost" <tradingpost@lobo.net>
  • To: livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] More on Low Dairy and Meat Diets
  • Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2010 21:30:07 -0600


Agree. In Darwin, survival of the fittest originally meant survival of those
most able to adapt to changes in their environment. Not the most vicious or
most dominant. But don't tell the Good Ole Boys ...

paul tradingpost@lobo.net

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 6/23/2010 at 4:32 PM paul@oneseedling.com wrote:

>Governments come and go and yet peoples and tribes survive. I suspect
>that the survivors are the best prepaired, both mentaly and materialy.
>Luck probably plays some part.
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On Jun 23, 2010, at 3:13 PM, "Tradingpost" <tradingpost@lobo.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> If you've seen my previous comments on transition then I'll try not
>> to plow the same ground. You mention building community between
>> people and their governments. This angle on transition seems naive.
>> The powers that be, the money and ownership by the elite 1% in the
>> US, is not about to turn it all over to the unwashed masses
>> (including yours truly). If we learn anything from history it's that
>> the hierarchy of great wealth fights any change that limits or
>> undoes their control of property and resources and people. Here's
>> the man who said it best, before the disastrous Civil War:
>> "Power concedes nothing without demand. It never has and never
>> will. Show me the exact amount of wrong and injustices that are
>> visited upon a person and I will show you the exact amount of words
>> endured by these people." -- Frederick Douglass
>>
>> Consider the land itself, the soil and water. Who controls how land
>> and water are used, what they produce, and who profits? Almost all
>> land and more and more of the water is corporate owned for profit
>> (except federal land mosly in the West, which is also largely used
>> for profit). And transportation - who builds the rails, roads,
>> airports, freeways? Government. Who makes the cars, trucks, trains
>> and planes? Corporations. Who profits? Corporations. Who owns the
>> medicine, the fossil fuel industry, the solar and wind power
>> manufacturers? All corporate. Who profits? Corporations. Who owns
>> and controls the entire manufacturing base and banking and credit
>> business? Corporations. Who profits? Corporations. Who controls the
>> most powerful military machine the world has ever seen with hundreds
>> of bases all over the globe? Our government. Who pays for it? We do.
>> Who profits? Corporations.
>>
>> Now the question becomes: which part of this system is going to give
>> up their legal obligation to stockholders and go out of business so
>> sustainability can take over? Which corporations will give up
>> control of their lands, water, tollways, trains, planes, cars,
>> trucks, fossil fuels, medicines, power plants and the entire
>> manufacturing base of this country? So what does that leave the rest
>> of us? Very little that we can control for our own use to live
>> sustainably as we see fit
>>
>> Transition towns and ecovillages mean well. But they have yet to go
>> 1% of the distance. They still have to operate within the financial
>> system that covers the country. They mostly drive cars to get to and
>> from work (usually for corporations) and finance ecovillage property
>> through banks. They must pay the corporate power grid or pay
>> financial corporations to get solar or wind power. And they grow
>> part of their own food. When it's fair weather. Changing light bulbs
>> is a bad joke. So is a $200 solar setup that'll light one 45 watt
>> bulb - when the sun is shining. Oops, not at night! No, it's not
>> that easy. We have to let Nature take its course and try to adapt as
>> we can.
>>
>> Most of our garden beds are planted now, mostly mulched, with soaker
>> hoses from China, sold by OneStop corporation. Today we have to get
>> the old van towed to the shop over a tension pulley. It would take
>> half a day to get there on a horse, but we don't seem to have a horse.
>>
>> paul tradingpost@lobo.net
>>
>>
>> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
>>
>> On 6/23/2010 at 12:00 PM Tommy Tolson wrote:
>>
>>> Joseph Tainter's /The Collapse of Complex Societies/ is excellent
>>> source





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