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market-farming - [Market-farming] [Market-farming]Avery, Jill and Jay in Denial, Salatin, Transmutation, Marc gets Sloppy

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  • From: "marc" <marc AT aculink.net>
  • To: <market-farming AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: [Market-farming] [Market-farming]Avery, Jill and Jay in Denial, Salatin, Transmutation, Marc gets Sloppy
  • Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 22:43:10 -0700

Sorry about the links Rick. I did a 5 second search and only QC'd a couple.
Figured if someone gave a hoot they'd take care of themselves like you did.
Will do better in the future. At least it gave Jill and Jay a reason to keep
breathing.

Yep I remember. Stoessel and Dennis blew the Organic types out of the water.
They screamed and yelled but were unable to convert the public good will
into science and prove the superiority of the organic way so lost ground.
Even Barbara Wah-Wah was bummed.

Discussion of the safety of manure in agriculture and how to compost it
properly rumbled on for a while after that. Lots of references to already
defined poop processing standards and such. Rumblings about the superiority
of organic foods ebbed and flowed. The sun's darkening, earthquakes and the
second coming never materialized as a result of Stoessel's show.

A good time was not had by anyone. Even Stoessel was performing MAJOR tap
dancing in subsequent time slots to stem public opinion that wanted him
lynched with an organic rope.

The Salatin thing is no surprise. We discussed him on the Pastured Poultry
list and even I was surprised to find I had elevated him to Demi-god status.
Like Duh!

Turns out Andy what's-his-name, another farm book writer, was on our list
and Joel's neighbor. We'd talk about something Joel had written and Andy
would bee-bop over and ask Joel then email the group with Joel's answer.
Seemed Joel was simply doing his thing and expressing his opinions like all
of us. Seems some of his figures were untested friendly guesses.

My take is that Joel simply was a rather friendly farmer with some great
entrepreneurial outlooks on farming and marketing that worked. Joel seemed
to me to be one of those lucky common folks who was in the right place at
the right time and made a good thing out of it. His stuff worked pretty well
even though certain claims were never tested. I don't believe he meant to
mislead.

Good ole Andy turned out to be a bit of a stricter fella than the pastured
poultry group was so he went off and started his own group so he could have
the strictness he wanted. He and I had a falling out and I lost track of
him.

Joel's still perking right along and doing fine last I read. Last I read
some of his stuff was in the Stockman Grass Farmer or Acres USA I think.

The transmutation is not as strange as you would think. Plants seem to do
amazing things with simple water and fertilizer then some fairly strange
elements seem to magically appear that one would expect the plant to need.
Darndest thing. Adrianna knows more about this than I do and it was
intensely debated by some good people. I'll see if I can come up with the
stuff on it.

Marc Nameth

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Williams" <mrfarm AT frontiernet.net>
...
> I took a look at them and they are valid. But...
> There were a number of posts on this list...with inaccurate or
> outdate info
>
> Isn't Dennis Avery the guy who debated Joel Salatin and blew Joel out of
the
> water totally?
>
> If you read the transcript of their "debate" it leaves little room for
> wondering what the average person would consider to be the clear winner.
>
> I know that I am hard on Joel because while many of his ideas are great,
> some are nutty and some close to insane, particularly about his idea on
> cells being trasmuters of the elements and all:) But I really expected a
lot
> more from Joel in the debate and Avery had science on his side and Joel
had
> .... well ... the idea really of just believe in me and everything will be
> OK. That does not cut it in todays world. You need at least some factual
> information.
....





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