Skip to Content.
Sympa Menu

livingontheland - Re: [Livingontheland] Hydroponics & Soil Organisms

livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Healthy soil and sustainable growing

List archive

Chronological Thread  
  • From: "Tradingpost" <tradingpost@lobo.net>
  • To: livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Hydroponics & Soil Organisms
  • Date: Sun, 16 Aug 2009 15:41:30 -0600


Modified Biointensive.

paul tradingpost@lobo.net


*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 8/15/2009 at 9:16 PM Mary Dahout wrote:

>Paul,
>Can you tell us about the type of gardening you use? Do you have a
>website?
>Mary
>On Aug 15, 2009, at 8:25 PM, Tradingpost wrote:
>
>>
>> You wrote
>>> Its also important to remember that the purpose of soil is to hold
>>> up the
>>> plants and to hold nutrients that are then taken up by the
>>> plants. In our
>>> case, we use other substrates to hold up plants and supply the
>>> nutrients in
>>> with the water.
>>
>> Sorry but that's the old view promoted by all peddlers of
>> hydroponic equipment and supplies, hundreds of them if Google is
>> any indication. It's also the old philosophy of chemical
>> agribusiness. The idea that soil is nothing but an inert way to
>> hold up plants and hold nutrients for them has been discarded by
>> decades of soil science. Soil is an active process nurturing an
>> incredible microbial population that produces nutrients in
>> symbiosis with plants. This process cannot take place in water. On
>> this subject I'd suggest starting with The Soil and Health: A Study
>> of Organic Agriculture, by Sir Albert Howard, 1947.
>>
>> And I must add, the hanging gardens of Babylon and the Mayan
>> civilization were not hydroponic - contrary to the claims of the
>> peddlers. They grew on islands in soil.
>>
>> We have customers who won't buy tomatoes unless we assure them it's
>> not hydroponic. And we offer them samples on the spot, and they
>> have their answer. Of course after you spend so much setting up
>> hydroponic you can't say anything but how great it is. Otherwise ...
>>
>> paul tradingpost@lobo.net
>>
>>
>> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
>>
>> On 8/15/2009 at 4:38 PM Diane Kann wrote:
>>
>>> We have not had any brix testing done, though are considering. I
>>> know
>>> that
>>> some of the universities have done various tests (they have the $$
>>> to do
>>> so!) including brix. I believe Disney's Epcot has, too.
>>>
>>> As I said, we have many happy customers who come here, bypassing
>>> farms
>>> growing in the ground, to purchase our produce as they believe it
>>> is more
>>> flavorful and nutritious than the other produce they can find (at
>>> groceries,
>>> but also farmers markets, coops, and area farms) Is hydroponics
>>> always
>>> better? I doubt it. But it certainly can be very competitive.
>>> Expensive
>>> to set up? In many cases, though there are those who have set ups
>>> that
>>> were
>>> low initial cost. And traditional? Actually, hydroponics is very
>>> old---
>>> the hanging gardens of Babylon, the Mayan civilization,....there are
>>> examples from long ago when hydroponics was successfully
>>> incorporated into
>>> agricultural life.
>>>
>>> Its also important to remember that the purpose of soil is to hold
>>> up the
>>> plants and to hold nutrients that are then taken up by the
>>> plants. In our
>>> case, we use other substrates to hold up plants and supply the
>>> nutrients in
>>> with the water. Similar philosophy but different technique.
>>>
>>> Diane K
>>> very THANKFUL homeschool Mom to 9 blessings in
>>> Christmas, FL
>>> http://hocfarms.com
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 1:39 AM, <realfood@wonderfulfarm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Have you done brix testing on your veggies Diane?
>>>>
>>>> Blessings,
>>>>
>>>> Aliza
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> “Don’t ask what the world needs. Ask what makes you come alive,
>>>> and go do
>>>> it. Because what the world needs is people who have come alive.”
>>>> Howard
>>>> Thurman
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Hydroponics & Soil Organisms
>>>> From: Diane Kann <dianek59@gmail.com>
>>>> Date: Thu, August 13, 2009 12:22 pm
>>>> To: Healthy soil and sustainable growing
>>>> <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
>>>>
>>>> We grow just about everything using hydro or aquaponics. Lettuce,
>>>> spinach, and most greens are naturals for water systems, but most
>>>> plants
>>> can
>>>> be grown very well, depending on how they are kept. A big
>>>> advantage of
>>>> hydroponics or aquaponics is that we can completely control how
>>>> much of
>>>> which nutrients a plant is offered and also the amount of water it
>>>> receives. Some plants do best with less nutrient, others more.
>>>> Some
>>> need a
>>>> lot of water, others less. Tomatoes, for instance, are heavy
>>>> feeders and
>>>> fruit best when water levels are more consistant. We can monitor
>>>> all of
>>>> that and ensure best conditions. By using separate timers, we
>>>> can water
>>> our
>>>> tomatoes more than our radishes. Everyone gets ideal levels.
>>>> Our soil
>>> here
>>>> in Florida needs a great deal of work to grow things well. Our
>>>> pastures
>>> are
>>>> good, but we would need to irrigate and heavily fertilize for
>>>> vegetables.
>>>> Yes, we are able to grow more product in a smaller space (though
>>>> that is
>>> not
>>>> a huge benefit for us as we have 50 acres, except that we can use
>>>> less
>>> shade
>>>> cloth as needed).
>>>> Our big benefits come in the perfection of the product--our
>>>> customers
>>> come
>>>> to us because our product does have superior nutrition and
>>>> flavor. That
>>>> comes with careful monitoring of the systems, of course and it is
>>>> very
>>>> possible to water or feed at less or more than optimal amounts
>>>> (water
>>> logged
>>>> fruit and veggies are just not that flavorful!!). Soil grown in
>>>> more
>>>> forgiving in some of this, as it allows for more drainage and plants
>>>> naturally pull in the nutrients they need (assuming they are
>>>> there and
>>>> assuming that the pH levels are in proper range, etc) But
>>>> properly done,
>>>> hydoponics is an important growing system that has been proven to
>>>> be even
>>>> more beneficial in depleted areas.
>>>> As for organic, there are organic fertilizers that some of us use
>>>> and
>>>> plenty of organic pesticide options. We maintain organic
>>>> standards, in
>>>> additon to being hydroponic. It is actually easier in some ways--
>>>> since
>>> our
>>>> plants are out of the soil, we avoid most soil born pests and
>>>> disease.
>>>> Also, we can handpick the few windblown weeds that enter the
>>>> system. The
>>>> set up cost is high for most types of systems and it can be more
>>>> work
>>> than
>>>> growing in the ground. But we see a greater yield and a longer
>>>> growing
>>>> season than ground methods.
>>>> Is hydroponics for everyone? Probably not. But it can be at
>>>> least as
>>> good
>>>> as ground growing and in some areas, is far superior.
>>>>
>>>> Diane K
>>>> very THANKFUL homeschool Mom to 9 blessings in
>>>> Christmas, FL
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Tradingpost <tradingpost@lobo.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> But are you growing aquatic plants that naturally grow in water?
>>>>> I've
>>>>> always wondered why people try to grow soil plants in water when
>>>>> the
>>> produce
>>>>> doesn't taste right or have the same nutritional value. And how the
>>> downside
>>>>> can justify all the added expense of hydroponics. If you're
>>>>> looking for
>>> a
>>>>> genuine space saving system of growing, I have it.
>>>>>
>>>>> paul tradingpost@lobo.net
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
>>>>>
>>>>> On 8/13/2009 at 5:30 AM Diane Kann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> We do mostly hydroponics using a fish based fertilizer but are
>>>>>> steadily
>>>>>> moving toward more aquaponics where living fish feed the plants
>>>>>> and the
>>>>>> plants cleanse the water for the fish. A good aquaponics
>>>>>> system can
>>> be a
>>>>>> complete eco-system. For a school project, I might lean more
>>>>>> toward
>>> the
>>>>>> aquaponics model. Fish can be grown for food (tilapia are
>>>>>> popular) or
>>>>>> simply for nutrient production (some use goldfish or koi for
>>>>>> straight
>>>>>> production)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Diane K
>>>>>> very THANKFUL homeschool Mom to 9 blessings in
>>>>>> Christmas, FL
>>>>>> http://hocfarms.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 9:00 AM, Marty Kraft
>>>>>> <martyk@allspecies.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have been helping a school start a no-till organic garden.
>>>>>>> Now they
>>>>>>> are applying a for a grant doing hydroponics. Are there
>>>>>>> hydroponic
>>>>>>> systems that use various beneficial microorganisms to feed the
>>>>>>> plants? I must admit to some prejudice about avoiding soil to
>>>>>>> produce
>>>>>>> plants but have a small window of open mindedness on the
>>>>>>> subject. I
>>>>>>> know most are busy but experience or references i would be
>>> appreciated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marty Kraft
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>>>>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>>>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Livingontheland mailing list
>>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Livingontheland mailing list
>> Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland
>
>_______________________________________________
>Livingontheland mailing list
>Livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
>http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/livingontheland







Archive powered by MHonArc 2.6.24.

Top of Page