Baslinux mailing list

[sindi keesan <keesan AT sdf.lonestar.org>]

On Tue, 24 May 2005, David Moberg wrote:

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sindi keesan" <keesan AT sdf.lonestar.org>
>
> > This suggests that the SVGA X server might work where Xvesa conked
> > out.

Would the Nvidia server be faster than SVGA or Xvesa?

> SVGA is likely not much faster.
>
> > Would it help to run X without a window manager?  That might
> > be part of the reason VESA worked better. >
>
> vesa writes directly to the hardware. No fooling around with X
> and networks. icewm and swm do not affect the speed of MPlayer.
I thought they used a bit of cpu time.

> > #1 works on my PII (DVDs and MP3s and wav) and #2 does not and vice
> > versa for the PI (#2 plays MP3s and wav).  I will check #3, which
> > can decode mp3s on a PI, but how are we supposed to play DVDs with
> > sound using #3?

> I thought that #3 worked. Perhaps it didn't work when you wrote this.

I fixed my config error afterwards, yes.  I will try #3 on the PIII which 
did not work at all with #2, maybe tomorrow.  We are busy now putting 
together a 533MHz K6-2 and I am deciding whether to keep some old Opti 
929a and 930 and 931 sound cards which might work with enough modules and 
some odd settings.  They are said to produce good sound (powered).

> > I am starting to lose track of what works where and how and may not
> > test #3 on the PIII since #1 works there.
>
> #3 works everywhere. It is the version to use. Sometime I will fix
> the bzip2 bug and then I can kill #1 and #2 for good.
The bzip2 bug is causing the executable to get corrupted?

> > Are you still working on a version for both PI and later models,
> > that will play sound and DVDs and realaudio?
>
> What's wrong with #3?
Nothing - it was my config file.  I had thought you left Realaudio out of 
version 3 but you explained about that.

> > > > The sound was lagging behind the lip movement, and eventually
> > > > stopped, and the characters started to walk very very slowly.
> > > > The sound would stop after a few seconds (24-bit color) or 20 sec
> > > > or so (16-bit color).  My card won't do 16-bit color and Xvesa
> > > > won't do 8-bit. I will try SVGA server and 8-bit color some time.
> >
> > I think you also said SVGA would be more efficient than Xvesa even
> > with more colors.
>
> I don't recall that. A giant X configuration with real XVideo drivers
> and an appropriate XFree86 configuration file will much better than
> the SVGA X server. Usually plain old vesa (in CLI) works well enough,
> however, and is much smaller.

Is there any other reason I would want the Nvidia server instead of Xvesa, 
which works fine with this card?  I don't spend much time with X - just to 
use Opera, or xv, or xpdf.

> > > libmpeg2 (the default codec for DVDs) hates -hardframedrop and
> > > promptly crashes.
> >
> > What is -hardframedrop?
>
> It is an option to MPlayer which tells it to drop as many frames as
> it can. Whereas -framedrop is designed to give you jerky but
> watchable playback, -hardframedrop will break decoding and just
> draw whatever it can. -hardframedrop video can sometimes look like
> a bunch of blocks moving around the display.

Do you know how framedrop decides what to drop?   Is there a default 
quality (say 50%, or 75%)?  Does it drop more frames when there is more 
action?

> > > Not likely. Sound takes very little CPU time, unless you're using
> > > SDL (which is not the default)
> >
> >
> > Is this why someone requested SDL?
>
> I don't think so. Stephen with a ph (who requested it) didn't state
> a reason, IIRC. I've read that it's useful for when your OSS driver
> is buggy.

Which is not the case for sb?  I also got es1371 and esssolo1 working (on 
three PCI cards, for cases where I cannot figure out the settings or where 
all the IRQs are taken).  Trident appears to play, but no sound is heard, 
same for cs4232.  I am working at opti 929a and 931 but may recycle them. 
They have odd settings - io=530?  Good chance to learn isapnptools.

Which cards have buggy drivers?

> > Does 2.2.16 support it?
>
> I thought that you tried it with 2.2.16 and it failed. I'm not sure
> whether it works or not.
What were we talking about here?  I don't know how to try SDL sound.

> > > Try "-vc ffmpeg12". This may have different bugs, but I've found it
> > > to sometimes be faster than the default.
> > What does this mean?
>
> Which part? faster = smoother video. The different bugs may be that
> it may not work quite right with x11 and -framedrop. There's no
> harm in trying it.
I will try it - remind me tomorrow.

> > > PCs are fickle.
> >
> > This one seems a lot happier with the DVD drive as master not slave.
> > I have noticed that hard drives transfer slower as slave.

Dos 'Syschk' gives us speed ratings. The same drive gets a higher rating 
as master.  We put in a matched pair and measured once.

> I haven't noticed a difference. My DVD drive is slave, CD burner is
> master. I wonder if DVDs would play faster if I moved the DVD to
> master? The reason my burner is master is because my BIOS will only
> boot from the master CD drive, and the DVD drive doesn't work with
> burned CDs, which is the majority of discs that I boot with.

My DVD drive works badly with burned CDs - it gave me some reset message 
but eventually did find the CD.  So I would not try to boot from it, but 
the CD burner is now scsi - can you boot from SCSI-CD-ROM?  I can set the 
BIOS to one or the other, I think.  No problem as I don't need to boot 
from CD-ROM on every computer. (I played with DSL on another computer).

Let me know if master DVD-ROM drive works better.  I am still curious what 
we did to make things work.  Removing two IDE drives was probably not it.

> > > > ESC stops it in X11, ESC ESC in VESA mode then Ctrl-C to get
> > > > back the prompt.
> > >
> > > If you have a framebuffer prompt, the blinking cursor may need a "reset" to
> > > get it back.
> >
> > VESA uses framebuffer even without a framebuffer kernel?
>
> No. I meant that if you're using vesafb or atyfb and then try "-vo vesa",
> when you try to get back to the console the cursor may be gone. reset it 
> needed
> to get it back.
>
> > > > Summary 0.  K6-2 605MHz can be used with the first mplayer to play dvds.
> > >
> > > Third MPlayer should work as well. Second MPlayer is probably a dud.
>
> > I have not tried #3 on the PIII, where #2 did not work.
>
> CPU type doesn't affect the OSS sound bug.
But #2 would not even convert files on the PIII (-ao pcm).
I won't worry about it.  I will try #3 there soon with correct /config.

> > #2 plays Realaudio - does #3?  #1 was said not to, I think.
>
> All 3 have the exact same codecs. #1 cannot play certain RA files
> over the RTSP protocol. HTTP and FTP are fine.


Do you mean that #1 and #3 both cannot play certain RA files fetched via 
RTSP?  Will #3 be a little less efficient on the PIII?  If so, I should 
probably keep #1 and use #3 elsewhere.  Does #3 differ only in that it 
supports all models of pentium-generation computer?

> > > > 1.  I need to look up how to display subtitles.
> > > > 2.  VESA uses less cpu than x11 on my 'slow' 605MHz but you cannot
> > > > do anything else at the same time (can't use other vts).
> > >
> > > VESA almost always uses less CPU than x11. Try the xvidix driver
> > > sometime. It probably won't even work, but if it does it will be
> > > very fast.
> >
> > -vo xvidix?  I don't need any faster than VESA already supplies.
>
> But xvidix gives you a window, probably as fast as vesa if you get
> anything at all. The window may be moved around and you can get
> more flexible sizes than vesa. You can also switch vts during
> playback.

I will try it tomorrow.  Along with a list of other things if I can 
remember them all.  There was a way to smooth the video, and #3 on 
the PIII, and what else?

> > > > 4.  x11 might work better with X svga and 8-bit color.
> > >
> > > It would work better with XFree86 4.x and real NVidia drivers. This
> > > is a very large download, unfortunately.
> >
> > I have the SW71 CD - maybe it has the Nvidia package already.
>
> > From what I understand, free nvidia drives have only been available
> in the past couple of years.
Meaning not for 2.2.16.  Good, less to bother with.

> > > > VESA 2.0 is needed for VESA or FB modes.
> >
> > > If you don't have vesa 2.0 or framebuffer, your only option is X11
> > > for anything at a halfway decent speed.
> >
> > X11 with a better server than Xvesa.
> >
> > Our AGP video cards all seem to be VESA 2.0.  But your FB kernel
> > was not compiled to support the S3 Trio3D.
>
> The whole reason I compiled the FB kernel was for the vesa 1.2 S3
> cards. It looks like the S3 FB drivers don't work at all. Xvesa/SVGA
> may be your only (slow) option.

But your FB kernel is very useful with our Matrox and Stealth and Tseng 
cards and maybe also Nvidia.  It is much smaller than the SW71 framebuffer 
kernel (bare.i?).  And it works, unlike my attempt which included the ATI 
and Trio cards.

> > Does #3 do something better than #1 on a PIII?
>
> No. They are roughly the same except for CPU optimization. However,
> #1 has been completely replaced by #3.

Does #1 work a bit faster on a PII or later?  If so, I will keep it for 
playing DVDs.  How would I measure exact speeds, by looking at top while 
playing the same DVD with x11 and -framedrop?

> David
>
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keesan AT sdf.lonestar.org
SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org