permaculture

[Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com>]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uru_people

 
Koreen Brennan

www.growpermaculture.com
www.facebook.com/growpermaculturenow
www.meetup.com/sustainable-urban-agriculture-coalition


________________________________
 From: venaurafarm <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Floating garden in a lake in Borma; farmers 
picking tomatoes. Aquaponics at its best.
 
On 11/28/2012 10:28 PM, Rob Crook wrote:
> Lawrence,
>
> We could do the same thing with our floating islands in Lake Jordan and 
> Falls Lake.

Lake Jordan would be an ideal location for an experiment in floating 
gardens. It is slightly warmer there than where I live and Chapel Hill 
too. It is at the beginning of the Coastal Plain in the lowland plain 
below the old Uwharrie mountain range along Farrington Rd. to the west 
running parallel to the road running north south. This whole area has a 
distinctly different ecology than west of there. I lived near there for 
a year in the 70's and previously in the sixties.

Are you talking synthetic mats or natural? Would reed or bamboo work, 
interlaced with other fibrous perennials?

In Peru they use reeds of some sort to weave mats that become part of a 
huge floating island where they garden, build their homes and live.

> Rob Crook
> Managing Partner Floating Island Southeast
> 300 Waterside DR
> Carrboro, NC 27510
>
> 919-918-7788 home/office
> 919-260-5082 mobile
>
> www.floatingislandse.com
> rcrook@floatingislandse.com
> facebook: Floating Island Southeast
> twitter: floatingisland2
> robocrook

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Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 07:01:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
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Subject: Re: [permaculture] Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make
        Sense
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I know someone who is doing vertical farming in Hong Kong in a 37 story 
building. He is using lighting powered by solar and doing intensive 
hydroponics using a device which aligns protons in plants and allegedly 
creates double or triple the growth (no comment on how or whether this device 
works or what it does to plants - I haven't observed the results personally, 
this is just what I've been told - it supposedly works on similar principles 
to what Masaru Emoto has been studying). I'm not convinced that with high 
tech approaches, vertical farming cannot be profitable. Whether it is as 
healthy as it possibly could be is yet another question, but I would need to 
see numbers proving that it can't work. It can't possibly be more expensive 
than conventional "green revolution" ag - with its $300,000 nitrogen 
injection machines, oil imported from Iraq, etc!  And hydroponically raised 
food, cannot possibly be any worse, life cycle wise, and is probably quite a
 bit better than food grown in fields where soil is being depleted, water 
poisoned with nitrogen and pesticides, and huge inputs of more crap are going 
in every year, while we create super bugs and super viruses because of 
monocropping and our war against nature. Not to mention all the fuel used and 
the extraction process for that... And it can't possibly be more unhealthy 
than food grown conventionally with GMO crops, ever stronger pesticides, etc! 

Realistically, hydroponics is going to continue to grow in popularity and 
some people are going to try it in a vertical farm setting. If it results in 
a chance for ecosystems to recover, less carbon pollution, and less of the 
other problems created by conventional ag, then it is a step in the right 
direction. Is it a full permaculture design? No, but it's an improvement. If 
we end up subsidizing some or all of the building costs with play money 
created by the Federal Reserve, that may also prove to be a better Life Cycle 
choice than conventional ag. 

I think Toby made a really important point about the life cycle stressors of 
adding more people. It isn't just food, it is everything that people use. We 
need to address all of it to create truly sustainable human systems.  

People are either in the camp that humans are never going to do that 
(cynical) or that it is possible that humans could change and wake up and 
start being more ethical (optimistic). I tend to flip from one camp to the 
other, but I try to stay optimistic, because, why not? Life is more enjoyable 
that way. And when I see people who are introduced to permaculture - no 
matter what walk of life they come from - time after time become more ethical 
and aware and sometimes drastically change their lifestyles almost overnight, 
it helps give me hope. I know what the odds are, and the challenges, but I 
think all of us are in there pitching in order to change the odds in our 
favor and the favor of Mother Earth. 
 
Koreen Brennan

www.growpermaculture.com
www.facebook.com/growpermaculturenow
www.meetup.com/sustainable-urban-agriculture-coalition


________________________________
 From: Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 11:10 PM
Subject: [permaculture] Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make Sense
 
Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make Sense
http://ecogeek.org/agriculture/2984
"
Written by Philip Proefrock and Hank Green on 26/10/09

The inside of a skyscraper is, literally, the most expensive "land" in the
world. So it probably isn't the best place to grow our food.

The idea of vertical farming <http://ecogeek.org/agriculture/988> (growing
food in high-rise buildings in the middle of cities instead of out on
farms) has been gaining a lot of interest lately. Most recetly, it showed
up on 
BoingBoing<http://www.boingboing.net/2009/10/12/farms-as-skyscrapers.html>,
one of our favorite blogs. We've seen a few of these proposals, and we've
been following the concept for some time. It seems EcoGeeky enough, but a
quick glance at the actual economics of farming shows that this isn't ever
going to work.

At first, it seems to make all the sense in the world. Moving production of
food into population centers to eliminate shipping. Creating highly
efficient "food factories" that allow land elsewhere to be freed from
cultivation. But when you look at some of the practicalities behind
constructing buildings like these, vertical farms make no sense. As the
Vertical farm Project itself notes: "The Vertical Farm must be efficient
(cheap to construct and safe to operate)." And a vertical farm is the
opposite of efficiency."
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>From cory8570@yahoo.com  Fri Nov 30 10:05:12 2012
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Thanks for posting all of these and the other terraquaculture links too. Very 
useful - just forwarded these to one of my students who is planning to farm 
on 5 acres of developed swamp land in Florida. I just hope that greedy 
developers don't get the idea that swampland can be profitable because it's 
almost the only land left relatively untouched in the state of Florida. 
 
Koreen Brennan

www.growpermaculture.com
www.facebook.com/growpermaculturenow
www.meetup.com/sustainable-urban-agriculture-coalition


________________________________
 From: venaurafarm <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 9:51 PM
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Floating garden in a lake in Borma; farmers 
picking tomatoes. Aquaponics at its best.
 
On 11/28/2012 9:16 PM, venaurafarm wrote:

>Â  Â  Â   Philippine Basic Education: DepEd's K to 12: "Yes" to Rice 
>Terraces ...
>Â  Â  Â  philbasiceducation.blogspot.com/.../depeds-k-to-12-yes-to-rice...
>       Jun 25, 2012 – This article, first published in Philippine Star,
> was my attempt to ... For those in senior high school, we developed a
> curriculum based on the Rice Terraces .... Jurgenne Primavera is a
> Researcher in the Aquaculture Department ...

Global mangrove conservation efforts:

<>

Dr. Jurgenne Primavera is a Researcher in the Aquaculture Department of 
the Southeast Asian Fisheries Development Center in the Philippines. She 
holds a PhD in Marine Science from the University of the Philippines. 
She will use her Pew fellowship to promote protection of the country's 
mangrove ecosystems, which are threatened by construction of aquaculture 
ponds and other exploitation. Primavera's message is that mangroves can 
save lives and property from destructive typhoons, filter out silt 
runoff that kills coral reefs, provide nurseries to juvenile fish and 
shrimp, and renew fisheries catches.
    
Having spent many years promoting the construction of aquaculture ponds 
in mangrove areas, Primavera's message of mangrove protection carries 
significant weight. Primavera will develop educational materials and 
give thesis grants to high school and college students in the provinces 
of Iloilo and Aklan, where mangrove loss has been severe. In addition, 
she will promote improved government protection of mangroves and 
increased enforcement of current regulations.

http://pew.seafdec.org.ph/index.html

Sumber : 
http://philbasiceducation.blogspot.com/2012/06/depeds-k-to-12-yes-to-rice-terraces-no.html#ixzz2DZexNR6M


>Â  Â  Â   [PDF]
>Â  Â  Â   NATURAL FARMING IN THE : PHILIPPINES - Terraquaculture
>Â  Â  Â  www.terraquaculture.net/.../Workman_...
>Â  Â  Â   File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
>Â  Â  Â   The terraces protect the soil, preventing erosion from surface
> run-off and the forests above ensure continued water and nutrient flow
> to the rice terraces as the ...

From the .pdf [what a find!]:

TERRAQUACULTURE:

<>

The village of Bulpog is located at approximately 2400 metres above sea 
level in Ifugao province,
central Luzon, the largest island of the Philippines. It is an area 
characterized by mountainous terrain,
steep river valleys and large forests. The village is inhabited by a 
clan of Kalanguya tribes people,
farmers and foresters.
The farmers here operate a traditional system of farming, variations of 
which can be found throughout
the mountains of northern Luzon and in other remote regions throughout 
Asia. It is a system of farming
that was dominant in the Asia Pacific region before the introduction of 
mechanized/chemical
agriculture and/or pastoralism. It is a system of terraquaculture 
(earth-water farming),1 a natural
farming system that utilizes the existing features of environments 
(eco-structures) in developing highly
productive and sustainable systems. In particular it works with the 
natural flows of water through the
landscape, making optimal use of the water and the nutrients it carries.
In the steep mountain valleys surrounding Bulpog the basic pattern of 
the farming system is terraced
rice paddies as low down in the system as possible with vegetables grown 
around the edges of the
paddies and managed forest (pinguo) above. The forest is recognized as 
the source of water and fertility
that keeps the whole system productive. The terraces protect the soil, 
preventing erosion from surface
run-off and the forests above ensure continued water and nutrient flow 
to the rice terraces as the water
percolates through the humus of the forest floor and seeps downhill into 
the terraced paddies.

FOREST FARMING, COMPLEX POLYCULTURES & SELF-SEEDING PROPAGATION OF CROP 
PLANTS

The Bulpog clan of the Kalanguya people are true forest dwellers. Much 
of their food, their medicines,
shelter and many items used in daily life are products of their forests. 
Their cash crops of coffee and
betel nut are grown throughout the forest. Food grown in the forest and 
on its fringes includes avocado, coconut, taro, cassava, chili, citrus, 
papaya, banana, pineapple, rattan, ginger, yam as well as various
fungi and wild honey. The distinction between farmed and wild food is 
truly blurred in these forests. In a sense everything is ‘farmed’ in 
that selective ‘weeding’ of the forest is done in order to promote the
growth of the most desirable species but at the same time everything 
grown in the forest is somewhat wild as self-seeding is the main method 
of propagation and everything is grown in truly complex polycultures.

What is not grown in the forest, or on the forest edge around dwellings 
and along pathways, is produced as part of the paddy system. The farmers 
here grow from one to three crops of rice per paddy
field per year depending on the variety (hundreds of different rice 
varieties are grown in Ifugao province) and how much time they want to 
spend in their paddies. While rice is the main staple any
failure in the rice crop could be covered by the secondary staples of 
taro and cassava. The people here may be ‘poor’ but they are certainly 
in no risk of starvation! The rice paddies are also biodiverse 
polycultural systems. With the rice is grown taro and azolla, ducks,
molluscs and fish (various kinds of snails, fresh water crayfish and 
loaches). On the walls of the paddies legumes are grown, usually the 
winged bean (Psophocarpus tetragonolobus), a delicious and
highly nutritious bean that is also an excellent nitrogen fixer. Other 
vegetables are grown around the edges of the paddies but on occasion 
whole plots of vegetables are planted. These more recognizable
vegetable gardens are used to form new terraces. The farmers create rows 
running with the slope so that the act of gardening slowly moves the 
soil downhill, eventually creating a level terrace that can be used
as a paddy.

<>
[This is so impressive! Talk about lush vegetation. What a wonderful 
diet they must have. This is great reading and contains input from 
Sandor Ellix Katz.]
<>

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From: Linda Ray <lindaray@att.net>
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Subject: Re: [permaculture] Oh Yes It Does / Let's Make This Clear: Vertical
        Farms Don't Make Sense
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Well, I guess the author/s of that article is entitled to his/their opinion, 
and I emphatically disagree with it.
 
It might not work if one's head is stuck in the "profit-driven factory farm" 
mindset, but it *definitely* can improve the health landscape if one is 
living in an urban food desert and needs to feed themselves/family an 
improved and health-augmented diet...
 
I mean, local, seasonal, Organic if you want it, the producer and his/her 
methods are certainly known to you- How does "whatever you can find somewhere 
else" compete with that?
 
Get real, authors. Or open up those tightly-closed eyes.
 
BTW ==> This would be a great course of experiment and study for 
homeschoolers :-).
 
Namaste,
 
Linda
-------------------------------------------------------------------

--- On Fri, 11/30/12, Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com> wrote:


From: Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make 
Sense
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Friday, November 30, 2012, 7:01 AM


I know someone who is doing vertical farming in Hong Kong in a 37 story 
building. He is using lighting powered by solar and doing intensive 
hydroponics using a device which aligns protons in plants and allegedly 
creates double or triple the growth (no comment on how or whether this device 
works or what it does to plants - I haven't observed the results personally, 
this is just what I've been told - it supposedly works on similar principles 
to what Masaru Emoto has been studying). I'm not convinced that with high 
tech approaches, vertical farming cannot be profitable. Whether it is as 
healthy as it possibly could be is yet another question, but I would need to 
see numbers proving that it can't work. It can't possibly be more expensive 
than conventional "green revolution" ag - with its $300,000 nitrogen 
injection machines, oil imported from Iraq, etc!  And hydroponically raised 
food, cannot possibly be any worse, life cycle wise, and is probably quite a
bit better than food grown in fields where soil is being depleted, water 
poisoned with nitrogen and pesticides, and huge inputs of more crap are going 
in every year, while we create super bugs and super viruses because of 
monocropping and our war against nature. Not to mention all the fuel used and 
the extraction process for that... And it can't possibly be more unhealthy 
than food grown conventionally with GMO crops, ever stronger pesticides, etc! 

Realistically, hydroponics is going to continue to grow in popularity and 
some people are going to try it in a vertical farm setting. If it results in 
a chance for ecosystems to recover, less carbon pollution, and less of the 
other problems created by conventional ag, then it is a step in the right 
direction. Is it a full permaculture design? No, but it's an improvement. If 
we end up subsidizing some or all of the building costs with play money 
created by the Federal Reserve, that may also prove to be a better Life Cycle 
choice than conventional ag. 

I think Toby made a really important point about the life cycle stressors of 
adding more people. It isn't just food, it is everything that people use. We 
need to address all of it to create truly sustainable human systems.  

People are either in the camp that humans are never going to do that 
(cynical) or that it is possible that humans could change and wake up and 
start being more ethical (optimistic). I tend to flip from one camp to the 
other, but I try to stay optimistic, because, why not? Life is more enjoyable 
that way. And when I see people who are introduced to permaculture - no 
matter what walk of life they come from - time after time become more ethical 
and aware and sometimes drastically change their lifestyles almost overnight, 
it helps give me hope. I know what the odds are, and the challenges, but I 
think all of us are in there pitching in order to change the odds in our 
favor and the favor of Mother Earth. 
 
Koreen Brennan

www.growpermaculture.com
www.facebook.com/growpermaculturenow
www.meetup.com/sustainable-urban-agriculture-coalition


________________________________
From: Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 11:10 PM
Subject: [permaculture] Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make Sense

Let's Make This Clear: Vertical Farms Don't Make Sense
http://ecogeek.org/agriculture/2984
"
Written by Philip Proefrock and Hank Green on 26/10/09

The inside of a skyscraper is, literally, the most expensive "land" in the
world. So it probably isn't the best place to grow our food.

The idea of vertical farming <http://ecogeek.org/agriculture/988> (growing
food in high-rise buildings in the middle of cities instead of out on
farms) has been gaining a lot of interest lately. Most recetly, it showed
up on 
BoingBoing<http://www.boingboing.net/2009/10/12/farms-as-skyscrapers.html>,
one of our favorite blogs. We've seen a few of these proposals, and we've
been following the concept for some time. It seems EcoGeeky enough, but a
quick glance at the actual economics of farming shows that this isn't ever
going to work.

At first, it seems to make all the sense in the world. Moving production of
food into population centers to eliminate shipping. Creating highly
efficient "food factories" that allow land elsewhere to be freed from
cultivation. But when you look at some of the practicalities behind
constructing buildings like these, vertical farms make no sense. As the
Vertical farm Project itself notes: "The Vertical Farm must be efficient
(cheap to construct and safe to operate)." And a vertical farm is the
opposite of efficiency."
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