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[permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. don't forget Jean Pain
- From: Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com>
- To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
- Subject: [permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. don't forget Jean Pain
- Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2009 09:41:30 -0800
gavinraders@gmail.com wrote:
Okay, can't resist, so forgive me but (heh-heh), if you are irrigating and fertilizing, then it's not a Mediterranean climate any more, right?
But care to say why you think applying deep mulch is a "mistake" in mediterranean climates? I live and practice permaculture in california and I have watched deep mulches do wonders for buidling soil and productivity. Especially when partnered with urine fertilizers, compost teas, and comfrey/nettle extracts.
I've seen several instances where pastures, orchards, and other less-managed (non-irrigated) areas in Med climates were mulched blindly, and the result was wildfire in the dry season with loss of trees (mulch is flammable), loss of native forb species that could no longer come up through the mulch, and loss of ants as soil decomposers, greatly slowing return of organic matter to the soil. Often in drier Med climates ants replace worms as principal decomposers. Mulch favors worms over ants, and can actually interfere with dryland soil building. Sometimes. There are times when mulch works, and Jean Pain's method appears to be one of them. The cookie cutter is not a permacultural tool, and YMMV.
I was irritated at the following
http://www.holisticmanagement.org/n9/Education/InPractice_Archives/integratingpermaculture.pdf
where the author claimed that permaculture didn't work as well as holistic management, because, they said, Pc recommended mulch and other temperate/humid tropic methods in Med climates, while HM had much better techniques for brittle landscapes. They even admit using temperate and tropic strategies, calling that permaculture (the DM says: "permaculture designs for specific sites and climates") I don't know whether these folks ever took a PDC, but they had a weird idea of what permaculture is. There is nothing in HM that conflicts with permaculture, but they operate on different levels.
I agree with Skeeter about clear subject headings. However, there is an awkward transition period between threads (which I think my last post falls in; I thought about it) where if you are segueing between topics, changing the heading moves the post to a new slot in the archives, and just where that should occur is hard to say. People following the old thread won't see the new one.
Toby
http://patternliteracy.com
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference
, (continued)
- Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference, christopher nesbitt, 12/08/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Lawrence F. London, Jr., 12/08/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Andrew McSwain, 12/08/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Scott Pittman, 12/08/2009
-
Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
paul wheaton, 12/09/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Tripp Tibbetts, 12/09/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Toby Hemenway, 12/09/2009
- Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference, gavinraders, 12/09/2009
- [permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. don't forget Jean Pain, Michael Pilarski, 12/10/2009
- Re: [permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. don't forget Jean Pain, Lawrence F. London, Jr., 12/10/2009
- [permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. don't forget Jean Pain, Toby Hemenway, 12/10/2009
- [permaculture] deep mulch in Mediterannean climates. more on Jean Pain, Michael Pilarski, 12/10/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Toby Hemenway, 12/09/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Tripp Tibbetts, 12/09/2009
- [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Mitch Triplett, 12/11/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Ben Martin Horst, 12/11/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Tripp Tibbetts, 12/11/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Robert Waldrop, 12/11/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Lawrence F. London, Jr., 12/11/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Lawrence F. London, Jr., 12/12/2009
- Re: [permaculture] Thoughts on PDCs - Was US National Permaculture Conference (lengthy post), Mitch Triplett, 12/12/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
paul wheaton, 12/09/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Scott Pittman, 12/08/2009
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Re: [permaculture] US National Permaculture Conference,
Andrew McSwain, 12/08/2009
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