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[Steven Champeon <schampeo AT hesketh.com>]

on Fri, Sep 21, 2001 at 02:49:16PM -0400, Dave Spitz wrote:
> I am saying that our policies, whether or not you agree with them, do not
> justify what was done. And you're in sad, lonely company if you feel they
> do. And I certainly don't feel that we should say, "gosh, people are bombing
> us because they don't like our policies, so let's retreat and change our
> policies." For one thing, it's a lot more than just our policies that are
> driving this -- it is, as I've said before, an explicitly stated objective
> of these groups to destroy the United States, its political system, and
> anything connected with American values.

I'm having a hard time parsing that paragraph. It's my understanding
that our support of Israel, our military presence in Saudi Arabia, our
sanctions against Iraq, and various other policies have resulted in
the death of millions of Arabs and Moslems over the past fifty years,
most within the last ten or so. It is not clear to me what the ends
are that these policies are supposed to serve. Are you saying that
there is no relationship between our involvement in the area and the
terrorist attacks?

> Even leaders with an unquestionable hatred of US policy (if not the US
> itself) like Ghaddafi have called this a horrible injustice. Has the fact
> that close to 7,000 people were killed in a vicious, surprise, and
> undeclared attack not sunk in to you, man?

I flew to and from San Francisco the week before the attack. 

I flew to Maine via Boston's Logan airport the day before the attack.

My brother flew from Thailand via LAX two days before the attack.

I was in a motel getting ready to bury my aunt when we heard the first
tower had been hit.

My brother is supposed to fly back to Thailand on Sunday.

I drove nineteen hours to get home because there were no airplanes
leaving Logan, and listened to NPR tell me that the terrorists had
entered Boston via Portland as I drove around Casco Bay. We listened
to Congress offer to give Bush more power than any President has ever
had before, to fight an enemy he cannot name, as we drive on at 90mph
around Washington. 

Kindly don't tell me that I have no sense of the enormity of the crime
that was committed. On a day when we should have been mourning my
aunt, who ended treatment for cancer when it became clear that she had
lost the battle, we instead listened to her minister speak of divine
vengeance and retribution.

> What would be enough to convince you, a nuclear detonation in a
> major city? Anthrax spread over entire segments of the population?
> 500,000 people killed? 1,000,000? Don't doubt for a minute that
> these terrorists would carry out these acts if they could.

Why do you doubt for a minute that they can't? Why do you doubt for a
minute that they will not? Why do you seem to feel that massive
military response will send the right message, when it is the fact of
our military response to the invasion of Kuwait and our continued
occupation of Saudi Arabia and Iraq that likely led to the attack in
the first place?

> We are not talking about "justice under international law", or
> revenge, or retaliation. We are talking about self defense against
> future attack by people who have sworn to die trying to annihilate
> the US and everything it stands for. It's not just "the policies".

You're talking about trying to eliminate glass shards by breaking
windows you can't even find.

> And while I agree with some of your examples, such as abandoning the
> Afghanis after the Soviet pull-out, some of them are ludicrous. The
> US is not immune from mistakes, even mistakes that cost lives. But
> "Mass starvation of the Iraqi people"? Give me a break. Next you'll
> be telling me how kind and loving Saddam is.

No, I think Saddam is a tinpot lunatic. But if you deny that sanctions
against Iraq have resulted in the starvation of anywhere from half
a million to a million and a half Iraqis while Hussein remains in power,
I'm afraid we can't have a conversation, as it's clear we're dealing
with different realities. 

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