Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Chavoux Luyt <chavoux AT gmail.com>]

Hi Rolf

I have just one question regarding your post...

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: "Rolf" <rolf.furuli AT sf-nett.no>
> To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Cc:
> Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 11:55:42 +0100
> Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Tense
>
> Dear List-memebers,
>
<snip>
> Now I will compare YIQTOLs with WAYYIQTOLs. I argue that the element that 
> carries the action forward in the sequence of events that constitue a 
> narrative, is not the verb, but the prefixed conjunction of the verb:  AND 
> he did that.. AND she did that, AND...  Further I argue that  WAYYIQTOL is 
> a YIQTOL with prefixed WAW, and therefore we expect that YIQTOLs  can be 
> used in past settings when they are preceded by a word element that 
> prevents the YIQTOL to have a prefixed WAW. This is exactly what we find!
>
>
> SOME EXAMPLES WITH PAST SETTING:
>
>
> 2 Kings 3:24-26: 4 YIQTOLs, 1 WEQATAL, 7 WAYYIQTOLs
2 Kings 3:1 (QATAL... WAYIQTOLs)
>
> 1 KIngs 13:33: 1 QATAL,2 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL, 1, 1 WEYIQTOL
& 1 Kings 13:1 (Also starts with QATAL)
>
> Hosea 12:5: 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 QATAL, 2 YIQTOLs
Hosea 12:4 (QATAL... WAYIQTOLs)
>
> Nehemiah 9:27: 2 WAYYIQTOLs, 2 YIQTOLs, 1WEYIQTOL
Neh.9:1 & 9:6 (QATAL... WAYIQTOLs)
>
> 1 Samuel13:17, 18: 1 WAYYIQTOL, 3 WAYYIQTOLs
1 Sam.13:6 (QATAL... WAYIQTOLs)
>
> 2 Chronicle 25:14: 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 2 YIQTOLs
2 Chron.25:1, 3,4 (QATAL... WAYIQTOLs) etc.
>
> 2 Samuel 12:3: 1 QATAL,  3 WAYYIQTOLs, 3 YIQTOLs
>
> 2 Kings 8:22: 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 YIQTOL (same root)
>
> Judges 9:38: 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Isaiah 39:3 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 YIQTOL, 1 QATAL (of BW() and 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 QATAL
>
> 1 Kings 3:15, 16: 5 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Joshua 10:11, 12: 2 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 QATAL, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 2 Kings 16:4,5: 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 2 Samuel 12:31: 2 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 QATAL, 1 WEQATAL, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 2 Samuel 15:6: 2WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Genesis 48:17 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 1 Chronicle 1:8: 2 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Genesis 29:2. 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Genesis 37:7: 1 WAYYIQTOL, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 2 Samuel 17:17. 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 2 YIQTOLs
>
> Judges 6:4: 2 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Daniel 12:8: 1 QATAL, 1 YIQTOL, 1 WAYYYIQTOL
>
> 2 Samuel 22:39. 3 WAYYIQTOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> 2 Samuel 2:28: 2 WAYYITOLs, 1 YIQTOL
>
> Ezra 10:8: 2 YIQTOLs
>
> 1 Samuel 1:13: 1 YIQTOL, 1 WAYYIQTOL
>
> I argue that the WAYYIQTOLs and the YIQTOLs represent the same form, and 
> that the prefix-difference is pragmatic, that is, >the reason why the 
> YIQTOLs do not have a prefixed WAW  is in most cases that they are preceded 
> by another element that >prevents a WAW  from being prefixed.
If YIQTOLs and WAYIQTOLS represent the same form/tense/aspect, then
why is the narrative so often started with a QATAL instead of a
YIQTOL? Why not simply use YIQTOL and WAYIQTOL all the way? The
"traditional" opinion would be that the WAYIQTOLs is the continuations
in narrative of the same narrative (and thus the same time) that is
indicated by the QATAL that starts the narrative.

Now I know that even native speakers don't always follow the "rules of
grammar" even when speaking their own language and I can appreciate
that before the existence of "grammar school", people (including the
writers of the Bible) wrote as they spoke the language, rather than
according to a "good grammar" they were taught in school. E.g. I would
expect terms that can be compared to the English "I ain't gonna do
it.", simply because some writers of the bible would actually talk
like that. On the other hand, many of these "ungrammatical"
expressions were probably changed into "proper" Hebrew by later
scribes as the grammar of Biblical Hebrew became more established. So
how many of the "exceptions" to the ordinary understanding of the
Hebrew forms can simply be the result of "wrong" usage in common
speech (and therefore we would be mislead if we tried to use them for
formulating a grammar of "proper" Biblical Hebrew)?

Shalom v'chag sameach
Chavoux Luyt