permaculture

[mIEKAL aND <qazingulaza@gmail.com>]

Permaculture is full of dumb terms, not sure why this would be any
different.  Even the word permaculture itself has become so
misunderstood so as not to mean anything in common parlance.  The
majority of the people who use the term around these parts use it to
refer to annual gardening and maybe doing some sheet mulching.  That
use of it hasn't changed around here since I moved to these parts in
the early 90s.

And more to your point, her use of the term Zone Zero had almost
nothing to do with the permaculture zone system except for maybe
that's how she came to using it whan she was teaching school kids...
& as a yoga teacher and a dancer and performance artist she was far
more interested in using it to refer to the somatics of the body and
the space immediately around the body and way, moving moving moving.

carry on,

~mIEKAL

https://www.facebook.com/driftlessgrove
https://www.facebook.com/beyondvineyard
http://dreamtimevillage.org

On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 12:06 PM, Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com> 
wrote:
> Elizabeth's essay, which is beautiful and compelling, also illustrates my 
> point perfectly. Zone Zero in her use is not a zone and is not used to 
> design with like any zone. It's just a word to mean "the inner state of the 
> designer" that has nothing to do with zones. She, nor anyone else I've ever 
> seen, has used it as a zone that can have elements placed in it or be 
> arranged with respect to frequency of use, or has any thing else in common 
> with zones. For the 90th time, I am not arguing that personal work is 
> unimportant. I'm arguing that Zone 0 is a dumb term for it.
>
> Steve, I'm surprised (okay, not really, given your general orneriness) at 
> your crack about who appointed me god. You repeatedly criticize that 
> permaculture is being weakened and watered down, and zone 0 is a perfect 
> example--I would have thought you glad to see someone else is concerned 
> about standards and would support it instead of throwing snark (and who 
> appointed you god to do so?). We're all gods in permaculture--that is, this 
> is a system that is regulated from inside, and it's up to each of us to try 
> to keep the standards high.
>
> Toby
> http://patternliteracy.com
>
>
> On Jul 7, 2014, at 6:05 AM, mIEKAL aND <qazingulaza@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> My first wife, who made her living as a yoga teacher and a teacher of 
>> improvisation in the arts, used the idea of Zone Zero constantly in her 
>> classes and teaching.  Here's an essay she wrote about Zone Zero that was 
>> widely circulated in the mid 90s.
>>
>> http://dreamtimevillage.org/articles/taking_off_zone_zero.html
>>
>> I should qualify this post by saying she was an anarchist and was never 
>> interested in Permaculture with a capital.  Sadly for all of us, she died 
>> suddenly of pancreatic cancer in 2004.
>>
>> ~mIEKAL
>>
>>
>> On Jul 7, 2014, at 1:08 AM, Steve Hart wrote:
>>
>>> ZONE 00...I too have a degree of disquiet about Z00....as Mollison
>>> said...it was never part of the curriculum...but hey try and tell that to
>>> the thousands out there who are seriously committed to this sector. So
>>> perhaps the problem is the solution...work with it not against it. After
>>> all there are a lot of people, more every day it seems, that need this
>>> designing or often redesigning. A bit like reinventing ? Often too great a
>>> Design Challenge.
>>>
>>> Like Biodynamics...Mollison said ..ahh thatsFairies at the bottom of the
>>> garden shit...but when one actually takes the time to scratch the surface
>>> and explore the deeper corridors there we see tremendous opportunity and
>>> value not wise to ignore.
>>>
>>> Besides who invited you Toby to be the god in " cleaning up ambiguities 
>>> and
>>> logical inconsistencies that weaken permaculture terminology" ? Perhaps
>>> better time spent on cleaning up all the standards or lack of them as per
>>> Scott Pittman's recent podcast. God bless you...Steve Hart
>>>
>>>
>>> On 6 July 2014 22:57, Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've posted some thoughts on why I think zone 00 as the state of the
>>>> designer's mind is a bad term.
>>>>
>>>> It's at:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.patternliteracy.com/816-zone-00-right-intentions-wrong-term
>>>>
>>>> Zone 00: Right Intentions, Wrong Term
>>>>
>>>> "One of my pet projects is to clean up the ambiguities and logical
>>>> inconsistencies that weaken permaculture terminology. Today I take aim at
>>>> the term Zone 00, used to mean either the designer or user of a
>>>> permaculture design, or their inner state. It’s a concept spawned by good
>>>> intentions, but calling it a zone is logically inconsistent, redundant, 
>>>> and
>>>> worst of all, has no design use. The designer’s mind is a crucial
>>>> influence, but it’s not a zone. If it’s an influence on a design, that
>>>> makes it a sector, right? (If you just slapped your forehead and said
>>>> “Doh!” then you need read no further.) So let’s stop using the term zone
>>>> 00."
>>>>
>>>> Enjoy!
>>>>
>>>> Toby
>>>> http://patternliteracy.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> permaculture mailing list
>>>> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>>>> subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list
>>>> maintenance:
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
>>>> message archives:  https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/
>>>> Google message archive search:
>>>> site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture [searchstring]
>>>> Permaculture Institute USA http://permaculture.org
>>>> How to permaculture your urban lifestyle
>>>> http://www.ipermie.net
>>>> Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
>>>> https://plus.google.com/+Avantgeared
>>>> Permaculture: -- portal to an expanding global network of landtech
>>>> pioneers -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated
>>>> elements for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced
>>>> nature-compatible human habitat
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kia ora
>>>
>>> [image: Picture]
>>> *Steve Hart*
>>> Ecology Architect
>>> skype: stevenlawrencehart
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> permaculture mailing list
>>> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>>> subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list 
>>> maintenance:
>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
>>> message archives:  https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/
>>> Google message archive search:
>>> site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture [searchstring]
>>> Permaculture Institute USA http://permaculture.org
>>> How to permaculture your urban lifestyle
>>> http://www.ipermie.net
>>> Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
>>> https://plus.google.com/+Avantgeared
>>> Permaculture: -- portal to an expanding global network of landtech 
>>> pioneers -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated 
>>> elements for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced 
>>> nature-compatible human habitat
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> permaculture mailing list
>> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>> subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list 
>> maintenance:
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
>> message archives:  https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/
>> Google message archive search:
>> site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture [searchstring]
>> Permaculture Institute USA http://permaculture.org
>> How to permaculture your urban lifestyle
>> http://www.ipermie.net
>> Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
>> https://plus.google.com/+Avantgeared
>> Permaculture: -- portal to an expanding global network of landtech 
>> pioneers -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated 
>> elements for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced 
>> nature-compatible human habitat
>
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list 
> maintenance:
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> message archives:  https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/
> Google message archive search:
> site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture [searchstring]
> Permaculture Institute USA http://permaculture.org
> How to permaculture your urban lifestyle
> http://www.ipermie.net
> Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
> https://plus.google.com/+Avantgeared
> Permaculture: -- portal to an expanding global network of landtech pioneers 
> -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated elements 
> for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced nature-compatible 
> human habitat