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permaculture - Re: [permaculture] deer fencing - What Constitutes Good Permaculture Practice?

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  • From: chauncey williams <chaunceyfree@yahoo.com>
  • To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] deer fencing - What Constitutes Good Permaculture Practice?
  • Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2006 10:36:05 -0700 (PDT)

How about learning the pattern lifestyle of deer. If we were to understand
how deer operate a little better, maybe we can find a very natural way to
deter them from our garden. There are plants that deter deer as well as
plants that could attract deer to different areas. There is a good book on
the subject called "Deer proofing your yard & Garden" by rhonda massingham
hart.

I encourage everyone to think beyond simple fences and beyond to a more
natural awareness to the way the rest of life that we share this earth with
tend to live.

"Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lfl@intrex.net> wrote: Rain Tenaqiya wrote:

> First of all, Home Depot is an evil box store that drains money out of
> the local community- not a very good permaculture practice to shop there.

There was a front page article in a local newspaper entitled "Boxed Out,
local retailers feeling thr crunch from big box
outlets". IOW, there went the last locally-owned hardware store in our town
or there went the last farm supply store in
the county.

A new topic....

On the other hand, as an independent small market farmer (6 acres, 4 under
cultivation) and small manufacturer of hand
garden tools (using 50% recycled steel: used saw blades and ag implements) I
can say that there has never before been as
much opportunity to make a good living doing what I do as there is now. This
is partly due to a new trend toward
purchasing "locally grown" and "sustainably grown" agricultural products,
especially produce and especially by
restaurants. More sustainable growers using natural methods means greater
demand for good hand tools. Business is good
now and I expect it to get better. I am in the land of big boxes and rapidly
increasing population, decreasing farmland
and increasing numbers of small farmers selling locally, many at an
increasing number of farmers markets.

Are there any other market farmers or gardeners in this list?

Now then, if we're going to talk about what constitutes GOOD PERMACULTURE
PRACTICE, maybe we could each contribute
suggestions as to its meaning. For starters I would like to see respect for
and preservation of world agricultural and,
of late, permaculture traeaures. Traditional, indigenous beliefs,
knowledgebases, methods, skills and practices that
relate to agriculture. That includes everything from seed and plant
preservation (including forests and prairies) to
toolmaking, soil preparation and food preparation and preservation.


> Deer vary tremendously in their behavior around fencing. Sometimes two
> little four foot barriers about 4 ft apart
will work, sometimes a 6 ft fence, sometimes an 8ft fence. The topography
and vegetation also affects how effective a
fence is. If the deer are on the downhill side of a fence on a slope, it is
harder for them to jump it. Tree branches
along the fenceline and above the fence also reinforce the barrier. Deer
don't seem to care about getting shocked
unless the power is ridiculously high. You end up having to build a full-on
metal fence anyway.
>
> If you have money to buy lots of fence posts and wire fencing like what
> Larry described, it could be the best
long-term solution, although in the West, 6ft fencing usually works by itself
if you stretch another wire a foot above
it. Sometimes another wire a foot above that is necessary. The relatively
new plastic deer fencing is very effective
and requires fewer posts. It lasts a long time, especially in the shade, is
invisible, and can be recycled. It
generally needs to be pinned to the ground every so often. I would say this
is superior to metal fencing where you have
lots of trees around already. I have used it on deer freeways in suburbia
and have had no problems.
>
> My friend has problems with rabbits, wild pigs, and bobcats, so she's
> using three feet 2 in guage chicken wire on
the bottom portion of the fence, with one foot of it laying on the outer
portion of the ground. It hangs from a wire
stretched along posts put in about 15 ft or more apart. Then she stretches
another wire at 7 or 8 ft and hangs 6 ft or
higher plastic mesh deer fencing (it looks like bird netting and is cheaper
than the stuff mentioned above). This is a
very effective and cheap method. I am thinking about doing something
similar, only I plan to get 8 ft high plastic deer
mesh and cut it in half, resulting in a 6ft high fence that I can string one
or two wires above to increase the
effective height. My place is on a plateau so that the deer are below the
fence and have to jump higher to clear it.
>
> I don't like having noisy, hungry, and stinky dogs around, but if you
> like dogs and can train one well, it can keep
all sorts of creatures away, if that is what you want. And if you feed it
foods from the site, it could be a much more
sustainable option than an energy-intensive fence.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Rain

First class advice and very interesting, Rain.

LL

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