Homestead mailing list

["Lynn Wigglesworth" <lynnw1366 AT hotmail.com>]

I did more research into who this guy is and what he means. I believe he is 
intentionally vague for reasons noted below. He did a 'blogtalk' interview: 
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/ASKShow/2009/07/09/The-Andrea-Shea-King-Show 
It's an hour long show, and not that interesting.

His 'letter' first came out in July in tactical-life.com. Wagner first said 
that the 'fear' that he talks about, that is encouraging police to 'arm up', 
is the fear of civil unrest...the cops felt the need to 'protect their 
perimeters'. Then he said (in a round-about way) that the unrest would come 
FROM the cops...probably starting at the "local level", and implied that it 
would be against the government (he wasn't clear..intentionally, I suspect), 
fighting to uphold the Constitution. He mentioned all Obama's plans, how the 
'czars', answering only to  Obama, are unconstitutional, but especially 
Obama's 'citizen national security force', and how Obama will have a 
private (presumably armed and well-funded) army with whom the local police 
will have to interact. He was not unreasonable, and didn't make the wild 
claims that some others do, that couldn't be backed up; he seemed more 
worried that there wasn't enough info to really know what is going on in the 
Federal government.

Lynn Wigglesworth
Tioga Co. PA
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Lynn Wigglesworth" <lynnw1366 AT hotmail.com>
To: <homestead AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:55 AM
Subject: Re: [Homestead] Cops are Afraid


It's not clear what his "fear" is...that there aren't enough assault rifles
on the street? Not political?? Yeah, right. This isn't even very
well-written fear mongering.

Lynn Wigglesworth
Tioga Co. PA
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Leslie" <cayadopi AT yahoo.com>
To: <homestead AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:54 AM
Subject: [Homestead] Cops are Afraid


Just received this from a neighborhood police officer down the
road.......................

Bev, you wanted something for discussion, this one should get your
attention.

This is the mindset that is changing in the US, something our government is
ignoring or minimizing.

Had a talk with a street preacher yesterday, which I'll save for another
post.




Written By; Scott Wagner is a Police Academy Commander and Professor at
Columbus State Community College in Columbus Ohio, and Commander of the 727
Counter Terror Training Unit. A 29 year law enforcement veteran, and current
Deputy Sheriff, he is the Precision Marksman for the Union County Sheriff's
Office SRT Team.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Disclaimer: This is not intended to be political; rather the observations of
a veteran police officer, and are forwarded for information only to this
group of current and former law enforcement professionals.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note From a Cop

The fear on the street is palpable.

Ever since the election of Barack Obama as President of these United States
in November 2008, coupled with the election of a democrat party majority in
both the U.S. House and Senate, concern for the United States and personal
safety has ignited like a fire in dry grass.

Sales of guns - black guns, rifles, shotguns and handguns (particularly 9mm)
everywhere, have gone through the roof. AR15s have literally flown off of
dealer shelves, and only now in the spring of 2009, have I seen the display
samples of ARs begin to reappear on the wall of my favorite shooting
emporium after the initial post election rush.

Manufacturers of ARs are still working to catch up and some of the major
suppliers are as much as 150,000 guns behind. Not only that, ammo is in the
shortest supply I have ever seen in the 43 years of my shooting life. Have
you recently tried to get 5.56mm, 9mm or even .380 ammo?

Supplies of 5.56mm and 9mm ammo are in short supply due to the black gun
buying craze; .380ACP because of the rise in people getting concealed carry
permits and the resurgence of interest in convenient 380 handguns like the
fine Ruger LCP. In fact, in doing a review of the Ruger LCP, my gun store
only had a small supply of ONE .380 round on hand, the Winchesters 95-grain
SXT, which they had just gotten in. Unfortunately, I had to do a
30-roundreview of that pistol. There was none other to be found.

The 5.56mm was the first caliber to noticeably be in short supply. This was
first due to the war effort, the headlong adoption of 5.56mm rifles by law
enforcement agencies ever since the great LAPD bank robbery and shootout,
the general shooting public interest in and acceptance of the AR15 weapons
system along with a realization that yes, the AR does have sporting purpose,
and of course now, this new fear that
is on the street. Sales of ARs alsowent up following 9/11.

What is odd about this new fear is that it is not coming from the average
citizen gun owner out there, but it is coming from what to me is an almost
shocking source: street cops.

Street cops and SWAT cops that I know from various agencies - rural,
suburban and metro - in my area are scared. Cops that before November 2008
never gave much thought (that I knew of anyway) to politics or more
importantly to gun rights. For the most part, these are the guys that didn't
generally have any interest in shooting or gun ownership beyond keeping
track of where their duty gun is, and a few of them didn't
even do that so well.

The guys I am talking about now are some of the same guys who used to not
even carry off duty on a regular basis- but not anymore. They don't scare
easily, defenders of the Constitution of this State and the United States
(as our oath of office reads), have been buying ARs, survival gear, and all
the ammo they can lay their hands on. All of them (or I should say "us")
have been discussing and have been acquiring guns
to provide a layered perimeter defense.

We want something in .308 (or in my case a superb M1 Garand in .30-06) for
covering the outer perimeters, 5.56mm weapons for mid-range use (for some
with more limited funds, the AK-47 and 7.62×39 cartridge will suffice), and
for the close up stuff shotguns and handguns (love my Benelli M4 Tactical
and Beretta 92 9mm).

What are we suddenly so afraid of? Well in our discussions it seems to boil
down to four areas.

First, fear of federal government intrusion into our lives. Every time Ilook
at or listen to the news, there is something new and intrusive coming out of
the Obama administration and this Congress.

New tax schemes, government-run Canadian-style healthcare, a volunteer
citizen defense force (whatever that is, what happened to the National
Guard?) equipped with funding similar to our military, forced voluntary
"service" after retirement, a lack of a southern border with hordes of
illegal and criminal aliens pouring over our border, the swine flu scare as
well as government forced closing of thousands of privately
held Chrysler and GM dealerships, which will be the final nail in the coffin
for these companies and the list goes on and on.

But these items in the news are just the tip of the iceberg. We can't see
the full impact of these actions yet, but we don't know what was added into
the thousand of pages of stimulus package bills in the dead of night yet. I
predict however that when the plans contained in the stimulus packages go
into effect, a lot of us are going to be surprised if not shocked by what
has suddenly and sweepingly changed.

What also scares us is the second, well-founded fear that there is an
assault weapons ban looming, one that would make the Clinton Ban appear like
a look of disdain in comparison. I remember well the 1990s and the Clinton
years: the rise of militia groups, the "black helicopter" rumors and
paranoia, all of which was motivated by the Brady Law and the Assault
Weapon's ban. What if a new ban comes requiring registration or
confiscation and turn-in of banned weapons as what happened in Australia?

I watched cops and citizens alike purchase these guns at $900 dollars and
more, with custom or tricked out guns easily running into the $2,000 range.
Then add on all the accessories, red dots, lights, slings and anything else
you can name and you may have up to $3,000 wrapped up in your rig. I saw the
looks in their eyes.

These purchasers weren't spending this kind of money just to turn in the
guns for no compensation when a government tells them to. I foresee much
civil disobedience coming down the road.

Americans are citizens, and not subjects like the British, Canadians or
Australians. They just don't always obey the law blindly and not one officer
or citizen that I spoke to said anything like "I hope I get to keep this gun
for awhile before they are banned; They are fun to shoot, so I would hate to
give it up." It isn't going to happen, so the cop on the street and the
soldier on the base needs to think now what he will do if the orders come
down. I think you all get what I am saying here.

Which leads me to the third fear, that there is a revolution coming, yes, a
revolution on the scale of the original American Revolution. You can hear
this topic discussed on many of the talk radio shows by even the big name
hosts. The possibility of an armed revolution against the U.S. government is
being discussed, albeit very gingerly and fleetingly and as something to be
avoided, which it is. I never heard this mentioned in the 90s.

One of my quietest, low profile officer friends brought it up the other day.
He said that at some point in the near future, he felt there is going to be
an armed revolt if things keep going the way they are.

Something has got to give. I was shocked. Yes, I had heard this from some of
my more radical cop friends in the past, but to hear it from a guy like this
was unprecedented.

Now, these guys are not saying this will happen to foment volition, preach
sedition or to even participate. They just want to be ready if it happens,
to at least defend their families, because number four on the fear list is
general societal chaos.

Cops fear for their parents, wives, children or grandchildren more now than
ever before. Most cops are encouraging their spouses and loved ones to get
concealed carry permits. Not only that, but some of these same cops are
buying gun mounts for their personal cars so they can carry an AR in the
family ride at the ready all the time. They are also strapping on
heavierforms of off-duty hardware.

I have other friends that are issued ARs or subguns for tactical team use,
who always have their gear with them and are planning on just commandeering
these weapons for personal use in defending hearth and home.

Final Notes

This is pretty heady and maybe even dangerous stuff. Know fully that I am
not advocating anything here. I am reflecting to you what I see and hear
going on around me, and maybe saying things that haven't been said in the
open, until now. It is something to think about.

Written By; Scott Wagner is a Police Academy Commander and Professor at
Columbus State Community College in Columbus Ohio, and Commander of the 727
Counter Terror Training Unit. A 29 year law enforcement veteran, andcurrent
Deputy Sheriff, he is the Precision Marksman for the Union County Sheriff's
Office SRT Team.



_______________________________________________
Homestead list and subscription:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/homestead
Change your homestead list member options:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/options/homestead/lynnw1366%40hotmail.com
View the archives at:
https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/homestead



_______________________________________________
Homestead list and subscription:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/homestead
Change your homestead list member options:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/options/homestead/lynnw1366%40hotmail.com
View the archives at:
https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/homestead