Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Read, James C" <K0434995 AT kingston.ac.uk>]

Thanx. Do you know if yhwh is attested in these texts? And if so where?

-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of Patrick J. Emsweller
Sent: Wed 7/20/2005 5:49 PM
To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] yhwh pronunciation
 

James wrote:

Does anyone know of extra biblical Semitic texts which attest to the divine
name as a foreign god?

Reply:

I don't know if this has been mentioned or if you are already familiar with
it, if so I apologize.  If not, you might want to pick up "Cory's Ancient
Fragments of the Phoenician, Carthaginian, Babylonian, Egyptian and Other
Writers".  ISBN 0766158098.  This is a rare and expensive book, however
Kessinger Publishing has reprinted it at a reasonable price with I think
some added notes.  It is available through Amazon, or probably any online
book store.

Anyway just thought I would throw it out there for you.

-patrick

-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Read, James C
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:14 AM
To: Harold R. Holmyard III; b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] yhwh pronunciation

I sometimes wonder, but maybe I am just paranoid, if 
there are modern day Hebrews in high standing who keep 
the real pronunciation and meaning of yhwh as a closely 
guarded secret and pass them down from generation to 
generation to keep them alive.
I noticed before that someone mentiones that Josephus 
commented that 'it was no longer lawful' for him to 
pronounce the name, implying that it happened in his 
lifetime and that the current pronunciation was known to 
him. Does anyone know where exactly he says that? I 
should be very interested in reading the account.
It was also questioned before why ehyeh (hyh) is related 
to yhwh (hwh). I have reason to believe that as the name 
had already been widely accepted as being pronounced in 
certain way at the time of the penning of the Torah that 
this is why yhwh remained as it was even though the common 
usage in the Hebrew of that time was to use the hyh form. 
The reason I have come to this conclusion is the patterns we 
see in scripture before the widespread of the superstition 
which banned its usage.
1) Early MSS of the LXX show a hebrew tetragrammaton amongst 
Greek writing
2) DSS, in places, show archaic lettering of yhwh amidst the 
by now widely accepted aramaic lettering of the rest of the 
manuscripts
These factors led me to believe that the behaviour was to preserve 
its ancient pronunciation against the flow of evolution of the 
rest of the language. Thus Moshe wrote ehyeh as the normal way 
of saying the verb form in his day while he wrote yhwh which had 
already by now been written in stone (so to speak).

Does anyone know of extrabiblical semitic texts which attest to 
the divine name as a foreign god? 

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Perhaps, final waw is omitted because the ancients recognized it for what it
is, a vowel, 3ms suffix. Iod and hey are another two suffixes.
Similarly, in other instances, hey--mater lectionis--is omitted, leaving
iod-waw, iau. This could be either 1s + old 3ms suffixes, or pure vowels of
1s, 2ms, 3ms suffixes.
In other words, yahu variants are congruent with hypothesis of the
Tetragrammaton as "I, thou, you."

Vadim Cherny

> This brings up something I've been curious about for some time. Several
> of these names have variant spellings/pronunciations. The example the
> leaps to mind is that of אליהו ('eliyahu), which is also written (as in
> Malachi 3.23) אליה (eliyah). Does this reflect a difference in
> pronunciation in different regions (Northern Kingdom v Southern) or
> different time periods? And could it reflect a difference in
> pronunciation of YHWH, or is it assumed to be restricted to the derived
> names?
>
> --
> Shalom
> John W. Leys
> Graduate School, Jewish Theological Seminary (Student)
>
> http://eliyahu5733.blogspot.com/
>
> "Wonder rather than doubt is the root of all knowledge"
> - Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel
>
>
>