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  • From: christopher nesbitt <christopher.nesbitt@mmrfbz.org>
  • To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] IPC11 Musings
  • Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2013 14:59:39 -0600

I came away from the IPC with a charged battery. I think that, despite the
organizational challenges, the event was very positive. As delegates from
Belize, it was wonderful for us to meet so many permaculturists, all speaking
the same language, even if they were not actually speaking the same language.
We live in a backwater, semi remote, quiet, isolated, and have for a long
time, so we are disconnected from the world, and this was a great way to meet
people. I made some great friendships on this trip and reconnected with a few
people I had not seen in years. We met in groups with the delegates from the
Caribbean, and Latin America, and personally with many many participants. I
got to meet several people on this list there, peoples whose words I really
have enjoyed, and it was nice to see a face to go with the names Scott,
Koreen, Rafter, Eric, Andrew, Darren and Robyn (nice to have met each one of
you!). We met some really wonderful people.

Perhaps its because I live in Belize and have had a lot of dealings with
Cuban doctors for various things, ingrown toenail, malaria, dengue and a
minor stab wound, and we have friends and family members who have studied/are
studying in Cuba that we had a fairly good idea of what to expect. The lines,
the food, the cramped housing conditions? Those are daily Cuban realities.
Most of the participants from the developing world did not have much issues
with this. Some of the participants from first world nations did. All
Belizean students who come back from Cuba tell the same tales of hardship,
and they bring extra toilet paper, toothpaste, toothbrushes and other things
we take for granted. We brought a lot and left it for my partners nephew, who
is getting a bachelors degree in engineering near Havana. Here in Belize, we
sometimes sleep in empty school rooms in back villages while working in a
community for a week, and did not find any of the hardships to be
overwhelming.

The gate crashers, in some way, tested the permaculture ethics: care for
others. We did not have a problem sharing accommodations with four other
people, strangers on day one, but friends on day five. I am not so young that
I would not have preferred the relative comforts of the St. John or Veldado
hotels in Havana compared to the basic proletariat holiday accommodations of
Los Cocos, but, for us, the slight discomfort of Los Cocos was not a terrible
issue. There was always enough food, even if the food was not noteworthy
except for its blandness, and that it took a long time to get it. But what
mattered was that everybody was fed and housed.

On the same ethic of care for others, the all night debauched disco rave,
right outside our window, sucked. It was very "un-caring" to have the same
event every single night at Los Cocos. I could have understood one night, but
every night? We did not get a full nights sleep the entire time we were
there. I am definitely old enough where sleep is important to me. That is the
one aspect I would have changed, and one that certainly fulfilled at least
some of the Cubans image of westerners as being purposeless, decadent and
indulgent. That was "permie summer camp", to me, and I would have preferred
more sleep and more time in presentations or discussion of permaculture.

Like Scott, the agricultural part of most of the sites we saw did not >wow<
me, and I really, really wanted to walk away with an ooh! feeling. All of the
permaculture sites were nice places, clearly with lots of love and work
invested in them. Outside of the large urban gardens we saw, which were not
"permaculture", and one farm, most of the sites were small, and while they
had components of "permaculture", some of them felt like they had gone
through a check list and checked off items. "Water feature" >check< "Zones
1-5 labeled" >check< "Herb spiral" >check< "key hole bed" >check< I had
hoped to see more agroforestry and perennial crops, vertically integrated
stacked polycultures, aspects of permaculture that are tropical specific,
taking advantage of the year long growing season and the capacity for the
humid tropics to rapidly create food forests that have staggered and seasonal
harvest cycles and, when mature, offer very impressive energy returned on
energy invested. There was one urban site we saw that had a large caimito,
two avocado, a mango, some banana and coffee in it, and at least one large
fat pig, and that had a >wow< factor, for me, but other than that one site,
less than an acre, we saw nothing like that. That was my favorite site.

The one site that had that potential, the semi rural site above the cave, had
a lot of trees, at about three years of age. They were spaced very closely,
and I can see problems in the canopy by year ten. They also did not intercrop
any pioneer species, like banana, pigeon pea, pineapple and papaya in those
areas to take advantage of the temporal window of abundant sun light, and the
soil and production benefits of intercropping, though they did have blocks of
those on the same land. I really would have liked to see some more planning
on the temporal scale.

I think some of the limitations in permaculture site design we observed come
from lack of access to new or further information. One of the great things
about permaculture in these times is the rapid transfer of information. Cuba,
as we know, has virtually no internet, and information from the outside world
is hard to come by. Like many of the cars being locked in the 1950s, and the
youth culture in Havana, seemingly stuck in the 1980s, permaculture in Cuba
seemed to be in a specific time. A lot of what we saw came from a series of
PDCs which may (or may not) have been taught by people with or without a lot
of tropical experience, and subsequent design work was made without access to
further information from google, permies.com, this list serve or whatever web
based information most of us have come to have access to. There were no
aquaponics systems, no biochar, or... whatever new tools have entered the
tool kit of permaculture in the last so many years. I wish they had access to
more information, like we do.

I gave a presentation on "Ecosystem service replication through complex
stacked polycultures", with a slide show of the work we have been doing since
1988, discussing some of the problems communities in the foothills of the
Maya Mountains face, and the pending problems that need solutions. The
problems we have here, expanding population density, soil depletion, loss of
habitat, are not unique to Belize. The slide show showed some things that
have worked for us, since this land was citrus and cattle in 1988. Many of
the species we use they have in Cuba, and Cubas soils and weather patterns
are similar to Belize. The slide show went really well, and was well
received. It was the largest group of people I have every spoken in front of.
The Cubans really liked it. I think that is an area, perennial based
permaculture, with an emphasis on ecosystem service replication, that needs
expanding on in Cuba.

What did impress me is some of the same things that impressed Andrew, the
social aspects, open gardens, interpretive signs, community involvement and
management, some of which may only be possible in a rigid anti-property
statist model like Cuba. I was impressed with the way permaculture was
integrated at the community level. I have to feel that in the immediate
radius of every site we visited, the neighbors were observing and soaking up
information, even unintentionally. When systems works, as these systems all
were, they will be replicated.

I was impressed that while Cubans are "poor" in cash, they seemed rich in
their relationships. My partner became friends with a group of Cubans, and we
spent a little bit of time with them. The obvious affection between them,
their comfort and lack of social stratification was evident. They were in it
together. I also like that we saw that Cuba also have a floor below which
nobody falls. We saw no homelessness, and the only beggars we encountered
were admitted alcoholics who were both polite and apologetic. The streets of
Havana felt much safer than even the tony neighborhoods of Caracas,
Maracaibo, Lima, Managua, San Jose, Guatemala City, Panama City, Mexico City
or Belize City. I was impressed with the Cubans.

I also loved the conference and the convergence for the various
presentations. Quite a few people gave "wow" presentations, too numerous to
go into here, but one woman, Pandora Thomas, her presentation moved my
partner and I to tears. Much of what was presented was both inspirational and
an exhortation to do more. We arrived home excited to work.

The hosts and organizers, to me, did a pretty good job, minor logistical
issues aside. My four hours sitting in the sun at Los Cocos waiting for a bus
was spent in comradery with several groups of people, people who were
delightful and informative. My hat is off to all the people who made the
event happen, especially Andy and Margarethe and, or course, Roberto from the
Fundacion Antonio Nunez de la Naturaleza y el Hombre. Celini and I got to
hang out with a group of Cubans, and the Cubans were the warmest and most
generous people. On Day One at Los Cocos, Celini made the mistake of admiring
one of the ladies fishnet stockings (seeing a customs/police/immigration
official in a mini-skirt and fishnet stockings with an ancient S&W model 10
revolver on her hip on the way into Cuba was interesting), and the next day
she gifted Celini a pair to Los Cocos.

Celini and I got support to be there, a full scholarship for me, and a
partial scholarship for her, all made possible by very generous people in the
permaculture community, so we were filled with gratitude every moment of the
time we were in Cuba, (with the possible exception of trying to sleep during
the all night raves). I have not been told, still, who came up with the
funding, but whoever they are gets full thanks from us. If not for that
support, we could not have been there. We covered our own travel expenses,
and a percentage of Celinis fees, so we did have funds invested. Our cost was
not insignificant, but it was in the "doable" realm, and well worth it, even
on our limited income.

Lastly, again, we found this to be very valuable and eye opening. To be
amongst other people who are into permaculture was wonderful. We are setting
money aside for the Latin American convergence in Colombia in 2015, and,
possibly, in England. To be in a large group of people who speak permaculture
was a blessing in all ways, one that we had never experienced and left us
eager to participate in, again.

All in all, I walked away feeling that our time there was well spent, even if
the tours were truncated, the housing a bit crowded, and the food was, at at
times, monotonous. The lost time from the farms was worth the friendships
made and the collaborations possible by my being there. I cannot thank the
hosts who made it possible enough. And, the Cubans were awesome.

_____________________________
Christopher Nesbitt

Maya Mountain Research Farm
San Pedro Columbia, Toledo
PO 153 Punta Gorda Town, Toledo
BELIZE,
Central America

Country code 501-630-4386

www.mmrfbz.org
www.facebook.com/MayaMountainResearchFarm




On Dec 24, 2013, at 6:12 PM, Koreen Brennan wrote:

> Thanks to both Scott and Andrew for your thoughtful and illuminating
> comments. Cuba being my first major convergence, I was overwhelmed and
> overjoyed by the amount of information and opportunities to meet other
> permaculturists from so many countries doing many interesting things with
> the practice. I agree, Andrew, it was hard not to be in heaven, having the
> opportunity to see Cuban permaculture sites, a number of inspiring
> presentations and many more inspiring conversations.
>
> I too saw opportunities to increase yield and reduce waste, in both visible
> and invisible structures and Scott's words: "I think that we should be more
> mindful of our purpose and more engaged in the process than I feel was
> exhibited during this IPC", resonate with me if only because of the urgency
> of the situation of the Cuban people, and so many other people around the
> world.
>
> 400 designers in one location could have gotten a heck of a lot more done
> than we did. How can we accept the feedback loop, learn, challenge
> ourselves, and increase yield? There appears to already be a move to do
> this with the N Amer convergence planning, and this is encouraging!
>
> Koreen Brennan
>
> www.growpermaculture.com
> www.facebook.com/growpermaculturenow
> www.meetup.com/sustainable-urban-agriculture-coalition
>
>
>
> On Friday, December 20, 2013 2:12 PM, Scott Pittman
> <scott@permaculture.org> wrote:
>
> IPC11 Musings
>
> It had been 3 years since my last visit to Havana and the change was
> shocking. Many more automobiles spewing smoke from 1950's models of Ford,
> Chevy, Olds, Pontiacs and various other brands was throat tightening and eye
> watering.
>
> I was in Havana for the International Permaculture Convergence. The first
> event was a gala dinner in an old estate in the heart of Havana. The place
> was packed and there was panic among our hosts from Fundacion Antonio Nunez
> de la Naturaleza y el Hombre as the numbers continued to grow and they
> scrambled for more place settings, tables, and chairs. The problem was that
> over 140 unexpected guests had arrived who had not RSVPed their intention to
> attend. This set the stage for a chaotic two weeks of trying to accommodate
> 25% more people than had been planned for. It was also apparent to me that
> most of the attendants of this event were there to party rather than deal
> with the many issues facing the rapidly growing International Permaculture
> movement.
>
> Permaculturalists from 47 nations descended on Cuba over 400 strong and
> overwhelmed the organizational capabilities of our sponsors.
>
> The conference was held in a large Havana hotel and the speakers were
> translated into English and Spanish for those of us who are language
> challenged. For the most part the speakers were English speakers who
> represented both the well known and the unknown in the permaculture world.
> I was disappointed in the selections as I was hoping to hear from Latin
> American permaculture which represents an incredible array of projects. A
> majority of the presenters were from the U.S.A. and Australia. I was most
> impressed by Tierra Martinez an Argentinian permaculturalist who presented
> on projects both urban and rural that are making a difference in the lives
> of thousands of people through the work of his organization Instituto Na
> Luum.
>
> While the presentations of Albert Bates, Robyn Francis, Andy Goldring, and
> surprise guest Darren Doherty were very educational and exciting I was
> still left with the question of where are the Latinos.
>
> My sympathy and admiration went to the translators who were faced with
> multiple English and Spanish idioms and with speakers who seemed unaware
> that they needed to take into account that their words were being converted
> to another language. The translators continued with us for the rest of the
> journey, through the convergence and on the tour and did an incredible job
> against all odds. Herding cats comes to mind.
>
> The conference began what was to be a pattern of standing in line for meals,
> and standing in line for accommodations; sometimes for over 2 hours! This
> was again the surprise guests who suddenly materialized the night before the
> conference. This of course threw the whole schedule of speakers off and
> Roberto Sanchez, known for his role in the video "Building Community", was
> doing everything except pulling out his hair, and he may have done some of
> that.
>
> Our final day in Havana was an urban tour of permaculture projects. I had
> seen most of the projects three years ago so I only went on the morning half
> of the tour. I once again was disappointed in most of what I saw. This
> was definantly not permaculture! Sorry. It reminded me of the ubiquitous
> "herb spiral" which monotonously decorates every first permaculture design.
> I saw keyhole gardens where the key hole was too small to accommodate the
> knees of the gardener, paths that were considerable larger than the
> vegetable beds, and a shocking lack of food amidst the ornamentals. I
> certainly appreciated the proud gardeners as they took us through their home
> gardens pointing out the salient parts but it seemed more beginning "master
> gardener" level than having been designed.
>
> Is this sour grapes? I don't think so, I am attempting to inject a little
> realism into an event that took thousands of dollars, and gallons of fuel to
> bring to fruition and I think that we should be more mindful of our purpose
> and more in engaged in the process than I feel was exhibited during this
> IPC.
>
> I spent a lot of time reflecting on what is being taught, in the world at
> large, as permaculture? Is there any continuity in permaculture design from
> country to country, how subjective is what is being taught, following the
> whims and limited knowledge of the teachers. This is an important thread to
> pursue and I will continue this journal of my Cuban trip in the next segment
> "the convergence" where I discuss my presentations of "Capitalism and
> Permaculture", "Permaculture Professional Standards", and "Developing a
> "Permaculture International Aid and Relief Group". These are all subjects
> dear to my heart and, much to my surprise, were well received.
>
> Lest I sound dour and curmudgeonly I would like to say over all my
> experience was a very positive one and this was the result of many
> conversations with new and old friends who all share my concerns regarding
> the state of the world and permaculture.
>
> Scott Pittman
> www.permaculture.org
>
>
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