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  • From: "John D'hondt" <dhondt@eircom.net>
  • To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] Question for Toby and anyone else interested.
  • Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2012 21:36:02 -0000


Ah Dieter, In 1900 science could have taken it alright. And real science still can. Science is about curiosity and wanting to find out more than in bamboozling consumers to buy certain products.
In fact I think it is religion that is the problem for it was there that dogmas were launched concerning how special mankind was. It is clear that there are quite a few animals that are quite as intelligent as the average person and that plants have feelings and a sort of nerve system and that micro organisms exchange bits of information amongst themselves and with plants and the inorganic realm and it were scientists wondering who found this out.
john

Well, there has to be an interface between the organic and the inorganic. And it stands to reason that the line dividing the two is more or less arbitrarily drawn by the human mind. In fact, there is no reason to assume that Nature sees itself in the same dualistic terms as humans view Nature. Nature does not see itself at all, it is. So are we. That is the basic step science cannot take.

--- On Sat, 1/14/12, John D'hondt <dhondt@eircom.net> wrote:

From: John D'hondt <dhondt@eircom.net>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Question for Toby and anyone else interested.
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Saturday, January 14, 2012, 11:00 PM

But in my non-scientific moments I consider the Earth to
be alive, too. At
least we should be treating it that way.

Toby
http://patternliteracy.com


I think that the idea that the planet is alive is even
tenable
scientifically since many of the components of the planet
were formed and
are maintained by life forces. Also because the inter-
relations with feed
back loops of millions of different species of organism are
so complex that
it is simplistic to state the whole is not alive when we
are not always even
sure how to define "life" in the first place. (for instance
is a virus
alive?)
What makes it difficult for us is the difference in process
speed of a human
life and of the planet as a whole. Compared to the life
span of the planet
us humans are completely insignificant even with all the
damage we have done
in such a very short time. "Proof" of Gaia being alive
would be if the
planet spits humans out and goes on without us sometime in
the future.
john


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