permaculture

["Lawrence F. London, Jr." <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>]

On 9/17/2010 11:54 AM, Annie Pollock wrote:
> I think I could speak as an elder (50 something).
> My experience of the topic raised by Kevin was that no one picked up on
> his 'why?' question. I was very disappointed by the defensive responses,
> lack of interest in the depth of his question,and inability to grasp the
> opportunity of examining 'why?'
> So, why are young people(not only young people) genuinely disturbed at
> an occupying military force, with a deeply dodgy reputation for civilian
> wellbeing,

With an equal role played by the political, financial and industrial 
establishments, often an ill-informed, inexperienced role with improper
decisions and directives forced upon the military. Read about Sir. 
Richard Dannat, ex chief of the British army.

> teaching permaculture to a civilisation older than most
> western civilisations, in a geographical region where historically the
> local people are/were famed for their beautiful gardens, poetry, and
> self sufficiency?

Tell us more about this. I have heard this for years, a green beautiful 
Afganistan, pre Russian invasion, who destroyed much including their 
agricultural infrastructure and may have even used tactical nuclear 
weapons on the Afgans.

Beautiful gardens, poetry and self-sufficiency - who could want more; 
sounds like pre green revolution Iran when quanata were used to convey 
mountain water to farms to irrigate crops, used for thousands(?) of years.

> Why not examine what greenwash is in this century? If I imagine myself
> in the shoes of a civilian in Afghanistan or Iraq right now I would be
> more than fucking disgusted at the pathetic token gesture/irony of being
> helped with agriculture by part of the military machine. It doesn't add

What the newly trained permaculturists are doing can hardly be termed a 
token gesture. Keep the faith! Share the enthusiasm! This will likely be 
a long term program for the guard and the villages they offer assistance to.

> up - depleted uranium, drones,military'errors', people fired on for
> collecting water..... get real! (apologies for the rant, but I feel
> strongly about this one)

You haven't even scratched the surface of the point on the tip of the 
iceberg. Stick with positive actions, worthwhile programs like the one
Scott and Toby facilitated. Don't try to tilt at windmills. Save you 
energy for positive action, like the above. Rants are exactly what the 
evil monolith/oligarchs/cabal wants, it dissipates your energy, 
neutralizing your activism diverting you from more positive involvement
in action with staying power, long lasting change that counts on the 
ground. This list will help accomplish that.

> Why fear saying 'no' to a deeply non ethical organisation?

That organization saved you, and me, from the Nazis, the Japs and the 
Russians.

> These were just some of the good questions raised on ethics.

> Oh,and why, why, do people keep banging on about the value of experience?

Because that is what counts; it represents the foundation upon which the 
permaculture movement was built providing technology, knowledge and 
concepts to put to use directly in people's lives and continue doing so 
for centuries.

> I find that in this decade of my life I learn and act better, and make
> fewer mistakes, when I approach everything by firstly laying aside my
> own pre conceived ideas. I can pass on my life experience, but younger
> people are much sharper at picking up on a dead approach to a topic.
> Times have changed.

I don't see too many dead approaches to topics. We are talking about 
people with vision for the future and for present day hands on 
implementation in the field.

> As far of reputation goes, we are only as good as our last decision.....
> We stop learning when we stop listening to the question.

True.

> Annie
> ps. And why do all the bumble bees in my garden favour one chive plant
> in a row of sunny (for Scotland) chive plants?
> I keep watching but I can't work it out. :-)

Glad to have someone From Scotland in the list. What region do you live 
in. Back when I shared a libation with my parents before dinner & before 
I became a teetotaler & non smoker) my favorite drink was Isle of Islay 
single malt scotch - has a wonderful smoky flavor....
I think Islay is home to a number of quality distillers.

Cheers from North Carolina, in a period of severe drought.

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