Skip to Content.
Sympa Menu

permaculture - Re: [permaculture] arid soil building

permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: permaculture

List archive

Chronological Thread  
  • From: Dieter Brand <diebrand@yahoo.com>
  • To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] arid soil building
  • Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 14:57:03 -0800 (PST)

Bob,
 
A dirt mulch is a well known technique used in dry land farming.  Heavy clay
soil with low organic content has the tendency to dry out rapidly through
capillaries forming in the clay.  The capillaries first transport humidity
from the subsoil to the topsoil where it evaporates when it reaches the
surface.  This continues until the clay *closes down* and doesn’t give off
any more humidity to plants or to the air.  It still holds some humidity, but
to the eye and for all practical purposes it is stone dry right down to the
solid rock.  To prevent this evaporation, farmers first plough the field to
produce a fine powdery top layer of soil (the dirt mulch) which means the
capillaries from the subsoil don’t reach the soil surface and humidity is
preserved in the subsoil for plants to use.  After irrigation or rain, the
top layer needs to be hoed to prevent capillaries from forming in the soil
crust.  The hoeing is only shallow to a depth of about 3
to 6 inches.
 
Dieter Brand
Portugal


--- On Fri, 12/4/09, Robert Waldrop <bwaldrop@cox.net> wrote:


What do you mean by "dirt mulch"?

Bob Waldrop, Oklahoma City
www.energyconservationinfo.org



>From diebrand@yahoo.com Fri Dec 4 18:05:05 2009
Return-Path: <diebrand@yahoo.com>
X-Original-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Delivered-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Received: by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix, from userid 3002)
id 249B24C00D; Fri, 4 Dec 2009 18:05:05 -0500 (EST)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3 (2007-08-08) on malecky
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE
autolearn=disabled version=3.2.3
Received: from web63405.mail.re1.yahoo.com (web63405.mail.re1.yahoo.com
[69.147.97.45])
by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 554384C00B
for <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>;
Fri, 4 Dec 2009 18:04:57 -0500 (EST)
Received: (qmail 95553 invoked by uid 60001); 4 Dec 2009 23:04:57 -0000
Message-ID: <999689.95187.qm@web63405.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
X-YMail-OSG:
avocZQwVM1lIFwKzElpx731sKRLiud9wEE2iH1qXdc0CKDsKuuv_bHfdUcHyrzhYaCHhb7tPWKz2vPrASJt4lSv2fapMuaIGRuLN0jftC03RbzOg5FIFZjsb4PVLl9RbB4gXFY_c.q5gy9WxL3W.jXTw0eAgaKP3ltyp6TX2xpOAHpor0oHk7afkJOTdDuNps8oAk9O6ZnbskjoTKi01k0FIS0usHWdDhkuTyOA-
Received: from [92.250.90.19] by web63405.mail.re1.yahoo.com via HTTP;
Fri, 04 Dec 2009 15:04:56 PST
X-Mailer: YahooMailClassic/8.1.6 YahooMailWebService/0.8.100.260964
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 15:04:56 -0800 (PST)
From: Dieter Brand <diebrand@yahoo.com>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
In-Reply-To: <422836.6214.qm@web112411.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9
Subject: Re: [permaculture] arid soil building
X-BeenThere: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
Reply-To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Id: permaculture <permaculture.lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
<mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture>
List-Post: <mailto:permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sympa@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=HELP>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
<mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:05:05 -0000

Rain, you sure know how to embarrass a guy.  I will be too self-conscious to
write anymore, if I think you are going to save any of it for future
reference.  If I ever write a book, it will probably be about Natural
Farming, since I have followed this for years and much of it is unknown
outside of Japan.  The problem I have with this is that it doesn’t work very
well on a farming scale in the place where I live now.
 
I grew up on a small farm in the North of Germany.  There was always more
than enough humidity in the deep humus-rich soil.  To plant a tree you would
just put it into the soil and forget all about it. It would grow all by
itself.  When we first got this place in the South of Portugal 15 years ago,
I planted a few hundred fruit trees because I didn’t understand then just how
dry the soil would get.  Most of them died during the first summer.  Some
survived, but very few produce any fruit.  When I plant a new tree, I usually
water about once a month during the first summer and perhaps every second
month during the second summer.  After that, the tree has to survive on its
own or die because I cannot water a large number of fully grown trees.  If
you can spread compost and mulch under the tree once a year, you will find
that it can survive on a lot less water after a number of years, when the
soil starts to improve.  The feeder roots of a tree
usually spread to an extent equal to the circumference of the tree crown. 
So if you do water, that is how far you have to water.  But don’t forget, if
you water for more than a year or two, the tree will always need watering
during its entire life.
 
As I said, ours is a hillside property and every square foot has different
soil.  In the meantime, I have learned that I can, for example, plant a
loquat tree on a water line, where it will grow without irrigation and give
plenty of fruits.  The same tree, 30 feet further up the hill would not grow. 
There an olive tree may still grow.  Again, 30 feet further up the hill even
an olive tree wouldn’t grow, but a cork oak or madrone will still grow.  If
your climate and soil are anything like ours, I recommend loquat trees, fig
trees and citrus trees for fairly wet soil, quinces, olive trees, plum trees,
chestnut trees and walnut trees for somewhat drier soil, apricot trees for
even drier soil. Incidentally, loquat trees are among the few that can easily
be grown from seed.  Quince trees can be easily propagated by cuttings.  They
can also be used for grafting pear trees. 
 
Acacias will of course grow very well, but most are considered invasive in a
Mediterranean climate and we are not allowed to grow them.  Well, I have a
few, mostly mimosas, but they have already spread in this region long before
we moved here.
 
Dieter Brand
Portugal




>From venaurafarm@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 4 18:33:16 2009
Return-Path: <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
X-Original-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Delivered-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Received: by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix, from userid 3002)
id 002AD4C013; Fri, 4 Dec 2009 18:33:15 -0500 (EST)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3 (2007-08-08) on malecky
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=UNPARSEABLE_RELAY
autolearn=disabled version=3.2.3
Received: from smtp121.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com (smtp121.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com
[66.196.96.94])
by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 79CC24C00D
for <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>;
Fri, 4 Dec 2009 18:33:08 -0500 (EST)
Received: (qmail 65005 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2009 23:33:08 -0000
Received: from adsl-065-005-197-216.sip.rdu.bellsouth.net
(venaurafarm@65.5.197.216 with plain)
by smtp121.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com with SMTP;
04 Dec 2009 15:33:07 -0800 PST
X-Yahoo-SMTP: c5cR1iqswBAL69WHluJFuhWbBKf0NOdLgGLeT6yCzJZKlgZ.16E-
X-YMail-OSG:
FCHs4q0VM1kJD6E5M1cMS_zMw4Os03ec8_HGsAu7CIpZAHxv6gZ9Z0Jjrlqy85VcLv5bw7qE0mC7UksAcLLs2pvc1QD93uoIFK9IHQKRYoTc2H9GpZjTApF8qxzsXPdANtnskDIhZG3dtRC.kGz1AF.B0mw3ecp0dswfqfLpYBXVq9DZkkj_vTbZ5cuc2jeBNJ45KTwHoK6C.eJ6LQGgnnSwlVOeHASOdw4pWhBSrUFfFmd4KRhO5bKH.ytKiv_jn6wruqikLakbxvIjl1ons6aR9DLsx0RshXARiPknJbwNS4LL7WLpbqD3JU8F8AfMsKcQUibVk_arNxrzKFR9TZMs4egIbtqLXYeZLjhH02eA5Bd9xgXSVfEmXI6U
X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3
Message-ID: <4B199C33.7020107@bellsouth.net>
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 2009 18:33:07 -0500
From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (Windows/20090812)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
References: <948757.41392.qm@web63408.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
In-Reply-To: <948757.41392.qm@web63408.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Subject: Re: [permaculture] arid soil building
X-BeenThere: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
Reply-To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Id: permaculture <permaculture.lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
<mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture>
List-Post: <mailto:permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sympa@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=HELP>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
<mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:33:16 -0000

Dieter Brand wrote:
> Bob,
>
> A dirt mulch is a well known technique used in dry land farming.
Heavy clay soil with low organic content has the tendency to dry out
rapidly through capillaries forming in the clay. The capillaries first
transport humidity from the subsoil to the topsoil where it evaporates
when it reaches the surface. This continues until the clay *closes
down* and doesn’t give off any more humidity to plants or to the air.
It still holds some humidity, but to the eye and for all practical
purposes it is stone dry right down to the solid rock.

To prevent this evaporation, farmers first plough the field to produce a
fine powdery top layer of soil (the dirt mulch) which means the
capillaries from the subsoil don’t reach the soil surface and humidity
is preserved in the subsoil for plants to use.

<><>
If this is done after rain and when the soil moisture content in the
volume of soil that will be tilled (not lower) is low enough for tillage
without compaction occuring after drying then you will have a dirt mulch
cover with an extra amount of water retained in the lower layers of soil.
<><>

After irrigation or rain, the top layer needs to be hoed to prevent
capillaries from forming in the soil crust. The hoeing is only shallow
to a depth of about 3

<><>
It is my experience that, if you're not proceeding with planting, then
you might be better off leaving the crust intact as more water will be
retained in the lower depths of soil, under the dirt mulch. After all
under the crust you have more loose dirt mulch (unless all the mulch has
turned to crust - a good reason to create a deeper layer of it
so that a loose layer is retained regardless of rainfall), therefore no
capillaries formed in the crust, if any, can connect with the dry, hard
soil underneath, thus no water loss through evaporation through the
surface crust can occur. It depends on your soil type whether
capillaries will form in crust. With mine, I would be way better off
leaving crust formed after rain after tillage to retain more water in
the soil reservoir for plantings carried out later on. Of course the
crust needs to be broken then.

If you're doing any brush clearing branches, leaves twigs can be placed
of garden soil for shade and water retention.
<><>

> to 6 inches.
> Dieter Brand
> Portugal
> --- On Fri, 12/4/09, Robert Waldrop <bwaldrop@cox.net> wrote:
> What do you mean by "dirt mulch"





Archive powered by MHonArc 2.6.24.

Top of Page