permaculture

["Peter Tagtmeyer" <ptagtmeyer@mail.colgate.edu>]

Our recreation is controlled.  Why are you away from your TV? 


Peter Tagtmeyer


-----Original Message-----
From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of d pfalzer
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 3:59 PM
To: permaculture
Subject: Re: [permaculture] psychedlics and permaculture

I wonder if when we choose to look to indigenous cultures for
inspiration on how to create a permanant culture and deduce that because
they used psychedelic mushrooms in a controlled manner, it is okay for
us to use LSD or whatever drugs we want recreationally -- if perhaps we
are taking a reference out-of-context rather grievously.  What do you
think?

--- Graham <grahamburnett@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

> I'm not that bothered what Bill & dave think about psychedilcs (no 
> disrespect, chaps), we should be thinking for ourselves, not looking 
> up to 'leaders'- isn't that the central message of
> permaculture- or is that
> anarchy??? Bill and Dave had great ideas, but I'm sure they'd be the 
> last to want to see them stand still and undeveloped... permanent 
> Culture doesn't mean its dead and static, rtaher that its sustainable 
> and evolving...
> 
> I also don't see why its 'conservative' to question the benefits of 
> drug
> taking- it could equally be equally seen as conservative to promote 
> LSD, dope, etc as 'mind enhancing'. From my experience around drug 
> users they often seem to be too stoned and apathetic to be much of a 
> threat to anything, let alone any sort of a danger to the 
> destructoculture status quo. All I've ever seen is drugs killing 
> creativity rather than enhancing it... What destroyed the hippy and 
> punk movements???
> 
> Yes I know 'legal' drugs do vast amounts of social harm, but I never 
> claimed that for me beer does anything other provide some enjoyement 
> and
> relaxation- though I reckon I've seen more creative ideas born over a 
> convivial pint or two in the pub than I have in any room full of 
> stoned hippys rolling joints on a Pink Floyd album sleeve saying 
> "Maaan" alot before falling asleep (and I am speaking from deeply 
> depressing experience...)...
> 
> I don't mean to come across as moralistic or anything, cos that 
> certainly isn't the perspective I'm coming from, and I certainly 
> believe that its everybodies right to do what the want with their own 
> bodie- but as Larry says this should be a free discussion
> space- but that goes both
> ways...
> 
> Cheers Graham
> 
> Kaia Bronte wrote:
> 
> >If I were new to the permaculture way I would ask,
> based on your statements:
> >which psychedelic drugs do Bill Mollison and David
> Holmgren recommend?
> >
> >The One Peace be with You,
> >
> >/ l.s. / Kaia Bronte
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> >[mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org]On
> Behalf Of Lawrence F.
> >London, Jr.
> >Sent: Monday, September 26, 2005 10:33 PM
> >To: permaculture
> >Subject: Re: [permaculture] psychedlics and
> permaculture
> >
> >
> >Rain Tenaqiya wrote:
> >  
> >
> >>I'm surprised to find such conservative views
> about psychedelic substances
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >  
> >
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> 


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