permaculture

[Mitra <mitra_lists@earth.path.net>]

The reaction to  the questions about industrial architecture surprises me, 
wouldn't it be smarter to use permaculture's own philosophy here, just 
applied to the human context rather than plants.

We all know that the most interesting places in permaculture are the edges. 
If we look at conventional industrialised agriculture as a weed that has 
take over the bulk of the system, then it seems to me there are several 
edges between permaculture ad it, including:

* Improving the effectiveness of permaculturists to make them more 
competitive, for example much of the advice on this list fits into that 
category.
* Expanding permaculture into areas friendly to it - e.g. encouraging 
organic farmers to adopt permaculture.
* Expanding permaculture into new areas - people who don't grow their own 
food at this time.
* Encouraging mechanised/industrial agriculture to try some elements of 
permaculture.

By ignoring the last edge, by discouraging industrial farmers who start 
asking intelligent questions,  is discounting probably the most potent way 
of reducing the harm done to our planet. Given the amount of land in 
mechanised production, even a 10% reduction in the harm it does to the 
environment will have far more effect than doubling the number of people 
practicing permaculture.

We cannot ignore the majority system out there which is trashing our 
planet, our models have to work and be viable in their interface with it. I 
see my own work (helping create businesses around sustainability) as very 
much related to that, we need models that allow permaculture (and other 
sustainability) ideas to thrive in the "real" world or our effect will 
always be limited to those few early adopters who are willing to make 
personal sacrifices for the good of the environment.

- Mitra

At 06:46 AM 8/30/2002 +0930, Wesley Trotman wrote:
> Are you for real? I thought this was a discussion group for Pc not
> industrialised agriculture.
> This planet cannot shrink the individuals eco footprint while we continue in
> the use of industrial agricultural. Food production must become a very
> individual personal activity and then only then will we personally accept
> the reduction in energy subsidised inputs.
> A primary concern of all should be the way humans have shortcircuited the
> closed loop of eco systems, which includes food.
> The looming petroleum reserves end and global warming in themselves will
> force our societies to change food production practices. Also dont forget
> pollution is the result of the short circuiting of the life loops.

Rick said
> > I know a farmer who grew fava beans and wheat together, and combined them
> > together, and sifted them apart.
> >
> > I know another who intercrops hazels and walnuts, running sheep and
> turkeys
> > under them, and of course has bees that work the flowers. That's just ONE
> > part of his farm.
> >
> > The startling thing is not that it's hard to do larger permacultures, but
> > that with all the economic trends and invisible structures barring the
> way,
> > so many are managing to farm in a permacultural manner.
> > -Rick