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msar-riders - Re: [MSAR] MSAR Standards

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  • From: Una Smith <una.smith@att.net>
  • To: Mounted search and rescue <msar-riders@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [MSAR] MSAR Standards
  • Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:54:04 -0700

What DHS grants? Who here is getting DHS grants? Raise your hands!

National level credentials sounds scary until you realize they would
reflect LOWER qualifications than state and local credentials. Unless
you're talking about "elite" SAR teams, in which case very few teams
will ever come anywhere close to that level nor need to be at that
level (else it isn't elite).

Even now, within a state or smaller area, some teams are more highly
qualified than others and will be called longer distances than others.
Does that mean those are the only teams worth calling? No. When we
need lots of searchers we need lots of searchers and we need most of
them for tasks that are not challenging, merely time consuming.

Dion wrote:
>If NASAR is the only agency providing a national level testing

NASAR is not an agency. NASAR testing is not national level, unless
"national level" means nothing more than available in multiple states.

An example of how NASAR isn't the answer is the infamous leaf bag in
the 24hr pack list. What is a leaf bag? A national hardware store
franchise sells leaf bags, with the words "leaf bag" printed on them.
A leaf bag is a brown paper bag, like a giant size paper grocery bag,
designed to turn to mush when wet. NASAR got that list from someone,
and similar lists are all over the internet. Here are some examples:

http://www.squadron601.us/blog/?p=72
http://ct022.ctwg.cap.gov/files/ES_pack_list.doc
http://www.mountainpathfinder.com/FUNSARpacklist.pdf
http://newyorksearchandrescue.org/download/SAR%20Ready%20Pack.pdf
http://www.scesar.org/html/NASAR_SARTECHTM_II_MINIMUM_PERSONAL_EQUIPMENT_LIST_11_2004.pdf
http://www.1srg.org/Contributed-Materials/PackLists/Walter.htm

Outside these lists, I have never read or heard "leaf bag" used to
mean the plastic bags SAR people and other outdoors people pack as a
matter of course. The bags we pack we often call "bin liners" and
black plastic trash (garbage) bags and garbage can liners etc. Not
leaf bags.

Dion wrote:
>Either way, the future is for
>National level or State level credentialing, just like all the other public
>safety responders.

Some states already have state level credentialing. New Mexico is
one of them, and I hold some of the SAR credentials recognized in
New Mexico. Some other credentials are well within my reach but I
choose not to take them, since I have no plan at this time to put
them to use. For me, it is not okay to seek out and get any and
all available training and credentials. I have only so much time
in my life, and training and credentials are wasted if not put to
good use.

New Mexico has a legal basis for its authority to regulate SAR in
the state. Many states do not have that.

If some state with such authority wants to mandate use of NASAR
products, that's for them to decide. However, as far as I know,
not one state that has such authority has mandated use of NASAR
products.


Dion wrote:
> However, as soon as you step over your
>county line to respond, you'll become required to comply with the higher
>level credentials.

Jorene Downs has stated much the same idea. Dion, did you get it
from her or did she get it from you? Where did you get it? It sure
is odd, and I'd really like to know where it comes from.

What makes you think a national requirement is a higher requirement
than a state requirement, and that a state requirement is higher
than a county requirement?

In most situations, the opposite is true. Building codes are a good
example. National requirements for many construction practices and
building products are lower than state and local requirements. Why?
Because some states have safety concerns that are not important in
other states. Some states are prone to hurricanes or tornadoes or
earthquakes or wildfire or flooding or ice storms or hail storms.
Others are not. That is why national standards are LOWER than state
and county and city standards.

In New Mexico all SAR responders need to know a little about deserts
and rattlesnakes. Those are of no concern in New Hampshire. Teams
in midwestern states generally need to know a lot about searching in
and around agricultural fields. That is of little concern in New
Mexico. Teams in mountain states need to know about avalanches and
altitude sickness and coping with deep snow. Teams in Florida have
no such need. Is a national standard supposed to satisfy minimum
requirements in all states? If so, then few or no teams will ever
meet that standard in practice. They may read and hear information
and pass tests, but they won't have the experiential knowledge that
comes from living and working in all these different environments.

I see a lot of great things happening in many states now to raise
the quality and quantity of training available to SAR responders.
For the most part there are no fees involved for either the teams
or the individual responders. I think that is a very good thing.

I see a lot of progress on MSAR-Riders too. Many, many readers
here now have a far broader and clearer view of MSAR and other SAR
specialties as well. And because of this, our teams are getting
more and better training.

Una Smith
New Mexico




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