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  • From: grady <grady AT ibiblio.org>
  • To: RTP-area local music and culture <ch-scene AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: Undergraduates and Local Music
  • Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 17:28:03 -0500

I think I read Randy as saying that the bands that some of us (myself certainly included) dearly love & hold up as being The Shit, as represented by [roughly half of] Compulation--des_ark, SBTN, cold sides, piedmont charisma, jett rink, Cantwell Gomez Jordan, Razzle, Pleasant--are, as 3rd-generation indie-rock (or 4th, or 5th, or whatever) maybe slightly difficult starting material for yr average G105-listening collegian.

And before y'all say "fuck the G105-listening collegians, they're hopeless & lost," may I please remind you all of the shite *you* were listening to in the fall of your collective freshman years. ;-)

That's the message I take from Randy's invocation of the more pop-friendly local acts in his post: Roman Candle (who are great, and who make very tasty pop-whatever music), Nathan Asher (who is, um, scary, but undeniably talented & who makes music that is immediately compelling on some level), International Orange (who, OK, bug the shit out of me, but who would be familar-sounding to the legions of Ben Folds fans).

There is a world of difference, musically, between Roman Candle & Cantwell Gomez & Jordan. Yet Roman Candle are really sweet guys, and the many bands like them are playing the same clubs as CGJ & are coming from much the same place philosophically, if not musically/aesthetically.

And I would argue that it *does* help to get the kids out to see bands like that because it's not a binary thing; it's a progression. I could easily outline for you a six-month course that ran something like this:

International Orange-->Rosebuds-->Sames-->Audubon Park-->Hotel Motel-->Cantwell Gomez Jordan, where each step is a definite step, yes, but the connections are clear & the steps seem approachable.

[it occurs to me that Jett Rink should be in there somewhere in the middle but I dunno exactly where, but you get the idea]

If I really wanted to read between the lines, which I sorta do, I would read Randy's critique as being partly a critique of myself, inasmuch as I have sort of elected myself as the guy who writes the blurbs about each week's shows, and posts them to this list. I have begged off & on for other people to also write blurbs about shows that I skip or can be reasonably predicted to skip, and sometimes people do so, and I for one am eternally grateful.

Keep in mind also that last time I checked, *both* the Cave and Local 506 were strictly 21-and-over venues, albeit with varying levels of ID-checkage at the Cave, at least. That is very much an "unapproachable" factor for the majority of undergrads.

Finally, I think you're totally right when you suggest that there's so much going on here that it's hard to know which ones are any good. Or more to the point: if I write glowingly about X weird-ass noisy bands per week, and Toenes writes about another handful, and Chris Parker another handful on top of that, and all of us use similar language (because fuck, man, describing bands is a drag, no matter how you slice it) and/or we all name-check bands that yr average kid hasn't heard of, then yeah, it can seem like a big ol' wall of noise with precious few handholds.

And then furthermore if somebody actually listens to one of us recommending some mindblowing indie-rock experience & they come away thinking "what the fuck was that insanity" then the temptation is to assume that everything else we recommend is equally hard to comprehend, even though 80-90% of what most of us write about is actually pretty fucking approachable--overly so, in fact. I mean, shit, it's just indie-rock.

I dunno whether I'm of the mindset to be a little patronizing towards the young'uns who appear to need handholding in the big dangerous world of indie-rock, or just suck it up and say fuckit, everybody benefits from somebody turning them on to good new music, and it's uncool to act too cool to want to share.

In this I always try to be more like Dave Cantwell, who, if you're talking to him about some hipster band he doesn't know, will say "I don't think I know about them; what are they like?" or something equally open & frank, rather than nodding & pretending to have heard all about them, which is what too many of us have done for too long.

But I digress. Or maybe that wasn't a digression. Not sure.

After thinking back again to what I was listening to when I was 18 (in 1988, for those of you into math)--the Cramps, the Misfits, Slayer, the Grateful Dead, Prince, Public Enemy--it's clear to me that I probably did need however much handholding I got when I went to college. Going from that stuff to Jane's Addiction, Sugarcubes, Pixies seemed like something of a leap to me at the time; in retrospect it seems painless & obvious. Going straight from my high school tastes to, say, Einsturzende Neubauten might have been somewhat more difficult without those mainstream-indie gateway drugs.

So who are the mainstream-indie gateway drugs of the local music scene, the bands you'd take yr kinda-hip-but-still-square cousins to see if they were in town visiting and the goal was to have fun, not to indoctrinate them?

Ross

p.s. I think a lot of them are on the Heard Together compilation, which is why I'm happy about it even though I already have nearly everything on it. It's not meant for me.


Mary Anne Barckhoff wrote:
Hi, Randy! Thanks for the post and your initiative
regarding the music scene. I think it's great that
you're striving to make a shift in the scene.

However, I'm curious as to what you mean by saying
that the music scene presents itself as
"unapproachable?" Considering that places like Local
506 and The Cave have shows that are free (or
virtually so), it's not the price at the door that
turns folks away. Are you commenting on the style of
music that local bands are playing? Do bands act rude
to students? What is it that you think would make a
band more "approachable" to students?
At any rate, there are a good 600 or so bands in the
Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill area, so there's certainly
not a lack of variety in musical styles (although some
styles are more heavily laden than others), so I find
it hard to believe that students can't find some bands
they like. Maybe the area is too overloaded with
bands and it's hard to know which ones are any good?

As a musician, I would be really curious to hear your
take on this!

-mab

--- william brafford <randyunplugged AT yahoo.com> wrote:


Ross and I have been swapping e-mails, but I'm going
to bite the mullet and take this discussion public.

First, let me introduce myself. I'm Randy, and I'm
dedicated to doing anything in my power to bring
undergrads out to shows.

The scene here can sometimes present itself
(unconsciously, I think) as a little more
unapproachable than it actually is. I've got the
Compulation CD here in my hand. One is tempted to
think that it only represents one side of the scene,
but that would reflect a false division of the scene
into sides. Maybe some of the more pop-rocky bands
aren't indie in 80s sense of the word, but if
they're
independent and local, I try to give them a chance.

I guess what I'm saying is that I think there's a
big
potential audience on campus for Nathan Asher,
International Orange, Roman Candle, etc. And if
students start going out to those shows, attendance
will rise across the board.

So that's the view from campus. Admittedly, I
haven't
been around too long and definitely don't know all
the
ins and outs of the scene, but you know I'll be
rocknrollin' a few nights a week.



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