Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Peter Kirk <peter AT qaya.org>]

On 23/11/2005 22:27, Karl Randolph wrote:

> Peter:
>
> The quote from Tomasino that you included so far does 
> express what I have been saying all along.
>
> What I objected to was your use of "forever" and "eternity" 
> because these terms, except for idiosyncratic and/or 
> idiomatic use, do not describe what Tomasino described. 
> As a native speaker of English (as found in America), I, 
> and  others on this list as well, saw by your use of the 
> above terms an argument for a meaning far different 
> than what we recognize from Tomasino's writing.
>
>  
Well, Karl, I only typed out a small part, section 4, of Tomasino's 
seven page article - although I did quote his "it often implies 
unceasingness of perpetuity", which clearly disproves your assertion 
that Tomasino's concept of `olam is not "forever" and "eternity". But I 
see that to make things clear I will have to type some more of the 
article. Here goes:

> 5. In many more cases, the nom. is used with longer time periods in 
> view  - indeed, it often implies unceasingness of perpetuity. The nom. 
> is used in this fashion to describe aspects of creation: in Ps 78:69; 
> 104:5; Eccl 1:4, the earth is said to have been established "forever," 
> i.e. it will continue to exist into the most distant future. 
> Similarly, the heavens and their denizens are established forever (Ps 
> 148:6). Zion, the mountain of God, is also established perpetually 
> (48:8[9]). Less permanent creations can also be described in this 
> manner. Joshua sets up a stone to serve as a "memorial ... forever" 
> for the Israelites (Josh 4:7). Similarly, Isaiah is told to inscribe a 
> judgment oracle on a tablet and a scroll, in order that it might serve 
> as a witness against the wicked perpetually (lᵉʻad ʻad-ʻôlām; Isa 
> 30:8). Nations, such as Babylon, can aspire to exist forever (Isa 
> 47:7; Obad 10; Ps 81:15[16]). Such aspirations are manifestations of 
> their pride and invariably provoke God's wrath. People, too, can 
> aspire to live forever, as did Adam and Eve (Gen 3:22). Moreove, the 
> Lord swears that his spirit will not strive with humanity perpetually 
> (6:3). Rather, there is a strict limit to humanity's violent time upon 
> the earth. Dan 12:2 predicts that after the final conflict between the 
> saints and the forces of the evil king, many of those who sleep in the 
> dusty earth shall be resurrected, "some to everlasting life, others to 
> shame and everlasting contempt."
>
> States of affairs, too, can be perpetual. In 1 Kgs 8:13, the temple is 
> established as a place where the Lord would dwell perpetually. (The 
> fact that the temple was eventually destroyed does not invalidate its 
> original purpose.) In 2 Sam 3:28, David claims that he and his kingdom 
> will be perpetually innocent of Abner's death, so that no guilt should 
> fall on him or his descendants. Elijah's servant Gehazi and his 
> descendants are perpetually cursed with Naaman's leprosy as a result 
> of Gehazi's greed (2 Kgs 5:27). The enmity between Israel and some of 
> its neighboring nations was to continue perpetually (Deut 23:3[4], 
> 6[7]; Ezra 9:12; Ezek 25:15, 35; cf. Ps 78:66 "everlasting shame".) 
> God's anger/enmity can also be described as perpetual. Several times 
> the question is posed, "Will (the Lord) always be angry (with Judah)?" 
> (Jer 3:5; 17:4; cf. Ps 85:5[6]), in light of the judgment of exile. In 
> Jer 14:4, the Lord states that his anger will burn perpetually against 
> Judah; in Mal 1:4, his anger burns perpetually against Edom.
>
> 6. The nom. is used frequently in connection with the idea of 
> covenants between God and humanity. God's unconditional promises to 
> his people are often described as perpetual or eternal...
>
> 7. As different aspects of God stretch back to antiquity, so do 
> various aspects stretch forward into perpetuity. According to Isa 
> 60:19,20, the Lord is an eternal light for his people, contrasting the 
> darkness that covers the Gentiles. God's word is also eternal. In Isa 
> 40:8, God's word is probably his prophetic pronouncements, which are 
> not annulled by the passage of time; in Ps 119:89, God's word refers 
> to the law, which is not subject to change (see also 111:8; 119:152). 
> God's covenant faithfulness (ḥesed), his commitment to his people, is 
> also eternal (1 Chron 16:34; 2 Chron 20:21; Ezra 3:11; Ps 89:2[3]; 
> 100:5; 106:1; 107:1; 118:1,2,3,4,29; 136:1,2,3,etc; Jer 33:11; cf. Ps 
> 117:2). Deut 33:27 speaks of God's eternal arms, whereby he protects 
> Israel. In a number of vv., it is stated that God reigns as king 
> forever (Exod 15:18; Ps 9:7[8]; 10:16; 29:10; 66:7; 145:13; 146:10; 
> Jer 10:10; Lam 5:19). Only a few vv., however, state that God himself 
> will continue to exist perpetually; Ps 135:13 says that the name of 
> the Lord endures forever, a metonymy for God himself. In Deut 32:40, 
> God swears to take vengeance on his adversaries, as he lives forever, 
> whereas Ps 102:12[13] says that God abides forever, in contrast to the 
> psalmist himself.
>
> 8. There are a few references in which the nom. ʻôlām is used to 
> denote all time, stretching both forward and backward. The phrase 
> mēʻôlām ʻad ʻôlām, from everlasting to everlasting, is used in Ps 
> 41:13[14] ("Praise be to the LORD ... from everlasting to 
> everlasting") and as a description of God's covenant faithfulness 
> (ḥesed) in Ps 103:17. In these cases, it does not mean boundless 
> eternity, but from ancient times until the distant future. In Ps 90:2, 
> however, where the same phrase is used to describe God himself, it 
> most likely means boundless time, stretching forward and backwards 
> into perpetuity.


I think this makes it clear that according to Tomasino many, but not 
all, occurrences of `olam do refer to true perpetuity, whereas others 
refer to the unimaginably distant future, or past. As such Tomasino 
himself uses the words "forever" and "eternity" repeatedly, so you 
certainly cannot claim that this is not his concept of `olam. There is 
no suggestion that the time is ever short, certainly never less than a 
lifetime. This is more or less what I have been saying all along.

--
Peter Kirk
peter AT qaya.org (personal)
peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
http://www.qaya.org/