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  • From: kgraham0938 AT comcast.net
  • To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Ex3:14
  • Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 16:48:27 +0000

@Vadim: You wrote
Whether a translation asnwers a particular question is irrelevant, though
one can prefer "I am" to "I will be" only on theological grounds. What is
relevant, is grammatical correctness. I showed few weeks ago on this list
that a theory of tenseless Hebrew is absurd, and Hebrew use of tenses is
perfectly consistent. Grammatically, the meaning is "I will be."

Vadim Cherny

Response: Well, don't you think that a translation should make sense? Even
though I understand your point of grammar, I don't think one can do proper
translation without context.


--
Kelton Graham
KGRAHAM0938 AT comcast.net

-------------- Original message --------------

> On 12/09/2005 07:19, Vadim Cherny wrote:
>
> > ...
> >
> >
> >We discussed this issue with issue a short while ago, and I proved
> >decisively that Hebrew uses tenses absolutely correctly, in standard
> >sense,
> >but allows, like Russian, deictic centre shifts. The theory of tenseless
> >Hebrew makes sense only for people who believe that all world uses tenses
> >as
> >English and German speakers.
> >
> >
>
> Vadim, whatever you may consider you have proved, in the light of recent
> discussions, you can only claimed to have "proved decisively" if your
> results have been published in a peer reviewed academic journal and
> gained wide acceptance. And for that to happen you would have to go into
> several linguistic issues in considerably more depth than you have done
> on this list. Otherwise I think the best that you can claim is to have
> an alternative hypothesis or theory.
>
> >Besides, as I also noted, how many yiqtols elsewhere are translated with
> >present continuous?
> >
> >
>
> Quite a lot. Rolf probably has figures for this. But you will find that
> only a small proportion of YIQTOLs in the Hebrew Bible are translated as
> non-modal futures.
>
> --
> Peter Kirk
> peter AT qaya.org (personal)
> peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
> http://www.qaya.org/
>
>
>
> --
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>From peterkirk AT qaya.org Mon Sep 12 12:58:11 2005
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Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] 11th century Codex Laurentianus V 3 says: YHWH = Iaou
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On 12/09/2005 14:30, David P Donnelly wrote:

>http://www.christianism.com/articles/13.html
>...
>
>What authority are 19th and 20th century scholars using
>when they say that Clement of Alexandria wrote “Iaoue”
>in his Greek Stromata Book V. Chapter 6 verse 34?
>
>While there are extant Catenas that claim that Clement of Alexandria
>wrote "Iaoue"
>in Stromata Book V. Chapter 6, verse 34,
>what Greek manuscript evidence were the authors of these Catenas using,
>when they quoted Clement of Alexandria as writing Iaoue at Stromata Book
>V. Chapter 6, verse 34?
>
>
>
In principle there could be evidence from quotations from Clement's
work, even in translation, which would suggest an alternative original
reading. For example, a quotation "IAOVE" or "IAVE" in an ancient Latin
father would be good evidence that Clement's original had a final
epsilon - or perhaps alpha-iota pronounced similarly.

But I too would like to see what the evidence actually is.

--
Peter Kirk
peter AT qaya.org (personal)
peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
http://www.qaya.org/



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