Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Karl Randolph" <kwrandolph AT email.com>]

Chris:

First of all, I don�t like adding to the text, so that rules out #2 below.

I read the text unpointed, which gives:

HYR( BRZL BRZL MCPWN WNX$T

When faced with a verse that does not have a readily understood meaning, as 
does this one, I then ask what are the various possibilities. In this one, 
the only word that can have come from different roots is the verb (in 
alphabetical order):

YR( to flutter or flap (in the wind) from the same root as YRY( curtain
RW( to sound forth (a trumpet)
R(H to feed
R(( to be displeasing from which we get the derived meaning that that which 
is evil or bad is displeasing, hence bad or evil.

A final question, is the prefix H- the definite article or sign of the 
interrogative?

One thing that I have found that makes Jeremiah difficult to read is that he 
often writes with allusions, in a round about way picturesquely describing 
actions and events in such a way that one often has to visualize the action 
and/or allusion in order to understand what is meant. This literary style 
apparently was common among the late, pre-exile writers, more so than in 
earlier Hebrew, and one of the signs of post-exilic writers is the almost 
total lack of such picturesqueness in the language.

And we can�t leave out the possibility that the subject for the verb may be 
found in verse 11.

If the prefix H- is a definite article. that limits the verb to YR( pointing 
to a subject in verse 11. The context points to the enemies coming from 
Babylon, a country, unless I�m mistaken, has no iron itself, but must import 
it, and unless I�m mistaken, the easiest place for Babylon to import it from 
at that time was from the former Hittite empire in the north. In this case, 
the translation would refer to the enemy �the one flapping (waving is better 
in English) iron (alluding to weapons), iron from the north, even bronze.� 
That also fits the context of the following verse where the enemy takes 
Judea, its forces and treasures, that God has given it.

If H- prefix is a sign of the interrogative, then  the subject would be 
�iron�, and I see no easy translation that fits the context. Look at the four 
possible roots, does any give an easy translation? E.g. �Does iron feed iron 
from the north, also bronze?� Huh? The same problem exists for a meaning of 
�flapping� (waving), �sounding forth�, even �to be displeasing� though there 
is probably a stronger case for that than the others.

In conclusion, I think taking the prefix H- as a definite article makes the 
most sense. It fits the context best, making the verse a dependent clause of 
the previous verse, pointing to a subject in that verse.

Karl W. Randolph.



----- Original Message -----
From: "Heard, Christopher" <Christopher.Heard AT pepperdine.edu>
> 
> Hello list,
>
> I am having difficulty reading Jeremiah 15:12.
>
> UNICODE TEXT
> *��2*�ָ*��1*�ַ *�ַּ*�ְ*�ֶ*� *�ַּ*�ְ*�ֶ*�
> *z<caron>ִ*|ָּ*?*��1*� *�ּ*�ְ*��1*�*?ֶ*�
>
> ASCII TEXT
> H:AYFROA( BARZEL BARZEL MICCFPWN WN:XO$ET
>
> Three contemporary commercial translations give three quite different
> renderings:
> NRSV Can iron and bronze break iron from the north?
> NIV  Can a man break iron--iron from the north--or bronze?
> JPS  Can iron break iron and bronze?
>
> It's clear what each translation is doing ... But it's not clear to me which
> one, if any of these, is correct, and why. Your thoughts?
>
> Chris
> --
> R. Christopher Heard
> Assistant Professor of Religion
> Armstrong Fellow in Religion
> Pepperdine University
> http://faculty.pepperdine.edu/cheard
> http://www.iTanakh.org
> http://www.semioticsandexegesis.info
-- 
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