Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Schmuel <Schmuel AT escape.com>]

Hi b-hebrew,

Vadim,
>Dear Joe,
>It is inconceivable, as you seem to imply, that Masorets introduced major 
>additions to the Tanakh. 

Schmuel
On this one, I give a hearty amen.

And one of the strongest evidences of the fealty of the Masoretes is often 
overlooked.
(In addition to the arguments below).

If there is one book that would have likely been subject to tampering, it 
would be Isaiah, 
and most especially Isaiah 53.  And yet the comparison of the Great Isaiah 
Scroll and
the Masoretic Text shows an incredible textual agreement, with many of the 
non-dialect
differences simply being obvious errors in the Qumran scroll, and very few 
differences
of great significance.  (Main source -- Fred Miller web site).

Whether or not you accept the Great Isaiah Scroll and the Masoretic Text 
Isaiah as the Scriptures,
it is clear that no tampering was done, despite all the centuries of 
disputation with Christians.

Ironically, in fact, as the article by Daniel Sapp points out.
"The LXX, 1 QIsa, and Mt Versions of Isaiah 53 and the Christian Doctrine of 
Atonement" in
 "Jesus and the Suffering Servant - Isaiah 53 and Christian Origins" 

..... the Christians would have a great difficulty doctrinally with the Greek 
text !
And not the Masoretic Text or the DSS.

(Granted, Vadim may well disagree with the Masoretic Text aspect :-)

Vadim
> Look at their commentaries to see how painstakingly these folks tried to 
> understand every minute 
> detail. Not the kind of guys you can suspect of the inserts. Even the 
> earliest known rabbis 
> addressed the issue of minor contradictions in the Tanakh. (snip)

amen.
Incidentally, one favorite proponent of the "Masoretes as tamperers" in the 
"Christian Identity"
anti-semites.... and for this reason, ironically, they often rail against the 
King James Bible.

Romans 3:1-2
What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 
Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of 
God. 

> (although I argue elsewhere that LXX as a whole did not exist still in the 
> 1st century CE) 

hmmm.. 
One vital point is that what is called the LXX is often diffuse and diverse 
and rather 
dubious manuscripts from 350 AD and later.  A text that could have been 
subject to
lots of corrupt alexandrian "Christian" scribe "smoothing" to match the NT, 
among other
problems.  And yet these texts are discussed as if it they were used, even in 
Israel, 
300 years earlier !   This I believe is a primary presumption blunder of much 
Scriptural
scholarship.  Floyd Nolan Jones discusses it some in a book on the web.

Vadim, I gather above that you are talking largely about the non-Penteteuch 
parts of the socalled
Septuagint.  If you could share your analysis, or point to it, it would be 
appreciated :-)

Shalom,
Steven Avery
Queens, NY


Schmuel AT escape.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/