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  • From: Isaac Fried <if AT math.bu.edu>
  • To: "<pporta AT oham.net>" <pporta AT oham.net>
  • Cc: b-hebrew Hebrew <b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Final nun
  • Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 22:13:09 -0400

Pere,

The attached personal pronoun is universal and need not correspond to the referential status of the unattached. Hence DOD-AN is DOD HEN, 'their [female] uncle'. But, as a noun, DOD-AN is '[male] cousin', with the personal pronoun -AN standing now for the person himself. For a girl it is DOD-AN-I-T = DOD-AN-HI)-AT, for the one, and DOD-AN- I-O-T for the many. In the Hebrew bible we find )ALM-AN, 'widowed' in Jeremiah 51:5, and XA$M-AN in Psalms 68:32.
New nouns are created in Hebrew from one root by adding personal pronouns. What exactly the BIT-AN of Esther 1:5 is I don't know. In spoken Hebrew a BIT-AN is 'a booth', by the [surely erroneous] understanding that -AN is for tiny, as in QATAN. Is $ULX-AN, 'table' a variant [for a big one?] of a lost $ULAX? Is it so also for )IYL- AN, 'tree'? And what about the DARB-AN of 1 Samuel 13:21, and the GARZ-EN of Deuteronomy 20:19?
In Ezra 6:4 we find NI-DBAK, 'stone course', with the antecedent personal pronoun NI-. Also NE-BRA$-TA), 'lamp-stand [of many arms?]', in Daniel 5:5.

Isaac Fried, Boston University

On Oct 10, 2007, at 12:38 AM, <pporta AT oham.net> <pporta AT oham.net> wrote:



The ending -UN = -HUN in YAD(-UN is a variant of the independent personal pronoun HEN otherwise used as a stand alone to designate a group of females. In contrast, in $MAR-U-M, and $MAR-U-N, the -U = HU) is for the plurality of the guardians, and -M = HEM and -N=HEN are for the plurality of the guarded. Notice also the difference between $AMAR-NU, 'we guarded' and $MAR-A-NU, 'he guarded us'.
The form -ON for an individual is found in XAR-ON, '[it is] anger', XESR-ON, '[it is] lack', XIPAZ-ON, '[it is] haste', and more. Possibly also in )AS-ON, 'calamity', )AT-ON, 'she-ass', and more. The radical/pronoun nature of the H,A,M,N,T,Y consonants of the detached personal pronouns )ANIY, )ATAH, )AT, HU), HIY), )ATEM, ) ATEN, HEM, HEN is sometimes ambiguous.
The ending -AN [the essential part of ANI, 'I'] is common in spoken Hebrew for a person doing something habitually or a thing having some inherent property: GAZL-AN, '[he is a] robber', XALB-AN, '[he is a] milkman', $AKR-AN, '[he is a] lier', SART-AN, 'crab', POTX- AN, '[it is a can] opener', all in accordance with RAXAM-AN-I-O-T = RAXAM-AN-HI)-HU)-AT, 'compassionate', of Lamentations 4:10 and XARC- AN, 'seeds?, kernels?, unripe grapes?' of Numbers 6:4.
_________________

How do you explain these two facts:

1. The final -N in BYTAN, palace (Est 1:5), built on BAYT, house.
2. (In modern Hebrew) The final -N in NEKDFN, nephew <> the classical NEKDFN, their grandson (of females), of NEKED, progeny, grandson (Job 18:19)?

Pere Porta
Barcelona (Spain)






Isaac Fried, Boston University

On Oct 8, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <pporta AT oham.net> <pporta AT oham.net> wrote:

If a letter is not
radical, then it is a personal pronoun.

_________

So, the final (paragogic) N in words like YFD:(WN, they knew (Dt 8:3), is a personal pronoun? If yes, please explain it.

Pere Porta
Barcelona (Spain)






Admittedly, it is not much to
work with, yet Hebrew manages admirably.
In the word (ACMA)-U-T, 'independence', from the root (CM, the
endings -U-T = HU)-AT, are two personal pronouns for the thing
itself. It is to be distinguished from (ACMA)-I = (CMA)-HI), '[he is]
independent', (ACMA)-I-T = (ACMA)-HI)-AT, '[she is] independent',
(ACM-AH = (ACMA-HI), 'strength', (CM-AT, '[the] strength [of]', (ACM-
U-T = (ACM-HU)-AT, 'essence', (ACM-I = 'self', (ACM-I-U-T = (ACM- HI)-
HU)-AT, '[the] essence [of]'.
In (ACAM-O-T = (ACAM-HU)-AT, the O = HU) is for the plural and the T
= AT is for the gender. Sorry, but that's all Hebrew has to work with
and we need to patiently bear with her.
Of course, the words (ACMA)UT, 'independence', and (ACAMOT, 'bones'
are related. They are related by their common progenitor, the root
(CM, 'to be massive, to be strong, to be substanial'.
The final H is a personal pronoun, not necessarily feminine. I have a
well thumbed copy of Zeidel's Hikrei Lashon somewhere here, but I
need to find it.
The word "paragogic H" is never going to cross the threshold of my
lips because it demeans the Hebrew language.

Isaac Fried, Boston University

On Oct 6, 2007, at 1:16 PM, Yaakov Stein wrote:

Isaac,

Please do not misunderstand my statements.
I am not sticking blindly to traditional grammar books,
and I have a lot of respect for researchers who try to systematically
discover the original forms using internal evidence and logical
reasoning.

However, as a scientist, I am also rather skeptical about theories
based on insufficient evidence.

To show you what I mean, imagine someone 1000 years from now
trying to understand the terminating WT in various words in modern
Hebrew.
He comes across )CM)WT (independence).
Someone tells him that the terminating WT is such words is
pronounced ut and is different from the terminating WT in
)CMWT (bones) which indicates a plural form.

But our researcher is unconvinced. He doesn't believe that Hebrew
speakers idiosyncratically distorted and bloated their words,
and claims that we can not be sure how the WT was pronounced
and that all WT meant plural forms. This leads him to conclude
that independence comes from bones, and he theorizes that
this derived from Ezekiel's vision of the dry bones.

OK, our researcher gets a paper out of this, but WE know that
it is nonsense.

How can we conclude that ALL terminal H mean feminine forms ?
Zeidel (Hikrei Lashon) gives examples of terminal H as an archaic
plural form.
We certainly have the directive final H.
So why is the paragogic H the only one you can't accept ?

Y(J)S



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