permaculture

[Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com>]

Simlar experiences I've had with the natural world are a big reason I am a 
permaculturist. There are many who feel the same way, you are far from alone. 




________________________________
 From: Daniel Jager <dfjager@yahoo.com>
To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org 
Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 7:11 PM
Subject: Re: [permaculture] "all of Nature has mind and memory"
 
Yeah, actually I have had more of those experiences, but I wanted to kind of 
'test the waters' on this forum.

I am all for science (I am trained as a scientist myself), but sometimes 
people can take science as a religion and in such cases they are often quick 
to ridicule that which is not readily measurable or which does not fit the 
present paradigm.

Glad to see that at least the mere mention of these ideas does not get 
torpedoed.

Daniel

> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 18:18:32 -0800
> From: carolyn anderson <cschampagne@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] "all of Nature has mind and
> memory"
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID:
>    
> <CAMzZNjyx4M9RJPEmx8k1fVGoBc95C7KkO+4iP+eunoU8kXz4mQ@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> I walk in the forest often and feel the communion of all
> that exists there
> every time.  I have given names to the rocks; hear the
> trees whisper,
> breathe and sing; feel the tender-loving-care of the earth
> under my feet.
> Of course everything that exists has consciousness. 
> It's consciousness
> that precedes existence!
> 
> No need to prove anything to anyone at all.  This is
> an experiential
> knowing.  Science wants data to believe what the heart
> already knows.
> 
> Carolyn
> 

_______________________________________________
permaculture mailing list
permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Subscribe, unsubscribe, change your user configuration or find out more about 
this list here:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
Garden Hand Tool Sourcelist and Biointensive Gardening Guide
http://www.ibiblio.org/ecolandtech/documents/gardening-hand-tools.faq
permaculture forums http://www.permies.com/permaculture-forums
Market Farming Mailing List
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/marketfarming
>From venaurafarm@bellsouth.net  Thu Nov 24 23:50:26 2011
Return-Path: <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
X-Original-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Delivered-To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Received: by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix, from userid 20217)
        id 91EC4E8ABA; Thu, 24 Nov 2011 23:50:26 -0500 (EST)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on 
mailman1.ibiblio.org
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
        DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,
        RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1
Received: from nm17-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com
        (nm17-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.236.21])
        by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C06E8E8AB4
        for <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>;
        Thu, 24 Nov 2011 23:50:25 -0500 (EST)
Received: from [66.94.237.198] by nm17.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with
        NNFMP; 25 Nov 2011 04:50:25 -0000
Received: from [98.139.221.50] by tm9.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with
        NNFMP; 25 Nov 2011 04:50:25 -0000
Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp103.sbc.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP;
        25 Nov 2011 04:50:25 -0000
X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 1160.67661.bm@smtp103.sbc.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3
X-YMail-OSG: Yh.X5NwVM1nnjEHz42sWu_xSLQidNFo6DzChDBFsu4pIb85
        xrrC5OqJVXoRQZG2y_qWfisRD798pX0OxHgpZcIt0ewyqbuFMlStfS8zNxOL
        gaypQVqYa_5b2x6nCYgbMd04jSmkY5UWIEuear_1INws3xgnuH_oowedxb48
        PHy8zcNrxeVOXsvUQl6j881l.Hm71dp3Y5vRkrro8BD1w0bESIIINhC1GBhd
        5G_f_sjHulj3xdCQwesVUng2vTxQioEp7GtL3GgdQI2TNH6Yz14Dq16wzvdE
        kyNpxa5POAB_MyOvlTb.lQkK5MBB0LMntBaT0VlSZqjhrevNjib6j0sCQj.C
        QMEL5VZKunJ53jQ0GQrA8HPinmOsHOuROVX0.W3UHzuKNw5yxqgNEO19zLjX
        FsnCi8dY7RKldI0jzTDcQ1VM04tWOmBE-
X-Yahoo-SMTP: c5cR1iqswBAL69WHluJFuhWbBKf0NOdLgGLeT6yCzJZKlgZ.16E-
Received: from [192.168.1.67] (venaurafarm@65.5.197.216 with plain)
        by smtp103.sbc.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP;
        24 Nov 2011 20:50:24 -0800 PST
Message-ID: <4ECF1E90.2010204@bellsouth.net>
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 23:50:24 -0500
From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:8.0) Gecko/20111105 
Thunderbird/8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
References: <4ECF12AB.1060902@uwo.ca>
In-Reply-To: <4ECF12AB.1060902@uwo.ca>
X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <4ECF12AB.1060902@uwo.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Subject: [permaculture] Fwd: [SANET-MG] is Harpin allowed in organic crops?
X-BeenThere: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
Reply-To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Id: permaculture <permaculture.lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
        <mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture>
List-Post: <mailto:permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sympa@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=HELP>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture>,
        <mailto:permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 04:50:26 -0000

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [SANET-MG] is Harpin allowed in organic crops?
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 22:59:39 -0500
From: jcummins <jcummins@UWO.CA>
Reply-To: Sustainable Agriculture Network Discussion Group
<SANET-MG@LISTS.IFAS.UFL.EDU>, jcummins <jcummins@UWO.CA>
To: SANET-MG@LISTS.IFAS.UFL.EDU

Harpin (MESSENGER®)
In nature, Harpin is produced by Erwinia amylovora, a bacterium that
causes the disease fire blight in apples and pears. A weakened strain of
Escherichia coli was modified to produce Harpin on a commercial scale.
Commercially produced Harpin protein is identical to the protein that
occurs in nature. E. coli K-12 is considered to be a non-pathogenic,
nutritionally deficient bacterium which is unable to grow in the
environment. Harpin is concentrated from the growth medium of the
genetically modified E. coli, and the bacterial cells are killed and
removed from the marketed product.
Harpin does not act directly on the disease organism, nor does it alter
the DNA of treated plants, but instead activates a natural defense
mechanism in the host plant, referred to as systemic acquired resistance
(SAR). This new active ingredient is currently the only broad-spectrum,
proteinaceous elicitor of SAR commercially available. Harpin is
effective against certain viral diseases for which there are no other
controls or resistant plant varieties. It also protects against
soil-borne pathogens and pests, such as certain nematodes and fungal
diseases, which have few effective controls except for methyl bromide,
which has adverse human health and environmental impacts.
The harpin gene has been used to produce GM rapeseed,
cotton,chrysanthemum and rice.However, these crops are in an early stage
of development.
I wonder if Harpin can be used in organic production?