permaculture

[Albert Johnston <johnston.albertg@gmail.com>]

Hello John,

I am a permaculture student of April's.  I would like to know where the land
is so I can look at the contour on Google Maps. Also I would like to know if
you would want the swales to be connected to a pond or dam?

How much rainfall and snowfall  is there per year?

Maybe if the swales solve more problems than the keyline plow that would be
the way to go.

We don't have any NW Arkansas type of land here in Florida. The landscape is
pretty much shaped by sand, wind, and rain. I was never much of a farmer. My
dad got into it when he was in his 70's. A late bloomer but a very wise
man. He had great luck just dragging chains behind his tractor to bust up
the cow pies. Our version of the keyline plow is the bush hog, or brush hog.
It mows down tall weeds into thatch. The heavy rains of summer and high heat
and humidity turn it into soil. Because he raised cattle there was not much
need for a plow.

Albert
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 6:32 PM, A Sampson-Kelly <
april@permaculturevisions.com> wrote:

> On assessing efficiency of swaling instead of keyline (BTW you can do a
> combination and you can't ignore the effects of keypoints anyway),
> much depends on the rainfall frequency and amount, soil type and vegetation
> type. If you have problem weeds too, this can be harder to manage with deep
> swaling,
> so i guess a good analysis would need to include a range of vegetation and
> animals that will help maintain this area.
>
> April S-Kelly permaculturevisions.com
>
>
>
> <mailto:info@permaculturevisions.com>
>
>
>
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>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>   1. Re: yet another rocket stove construction picture set (Jeff)
>>   2. swales vs. complete keyline design? (John Fritz)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2009 16:35:14 -0600
>> From: Jeff <toobeeorknottoobee@gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [permaculture] yet another rocket stove construction
>>        picture set
>> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Message-ID: <4A9AFEA2.6090105@gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>
>> Very nice, thanks for sharing! Did you include a clean out on the burn
>> chamber or do you just reach from the feed tube to clean out? I have not
>> built one, but I'm itching. -Jeff
>>
>> negiliblek wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Built this one in NM to heat a shower floor (and perhaps the water
>>> too)...
>>> ...it was my first large rocket stove!
>>>
>>> http://twobirdstone.blogspot.com/
>>>
>>> Since these pictures were taken, I've finished the hot water circuit too.
>>> I'll post 'em later if I can get to Internet access
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 09:28:01 -0700 (PDT)
>> From: John Fritz <johnfritz77@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: [permaculture] swales vs. complete keyline design?
>> To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>> Message-ID: <121902.78594.qm@web43136.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
>> ?
>> As a practical, economic matter, it seems that, for me, incorporating
>> swales on contour makes more sense than to buy a 60 h.p. tractor and 
>> keyline
>> plow, or hire someone who has these implements and is adept at using them.?
>> The only unknown variable is the efficacy of keyline landscaping, as a 
>> whole
>> system,vs. swale earthworks on contour as a stand alone strategy.? What
>> would I be losing if I just used swales to retain water in my soil, as
>> opposed to the time and expense of having a complete keyline design adapted
>> to my rolling land??? In particular I am thinking about the timeline of
>> energy descent and the availability of a professional keyline design 
>> several
>> years out (five, maybe more years) as opposed to obtaining the best swales
>> that I can now afford, even if the contour lines are less than perfectly
>> plotted.? One other doubt that I have is the resiliance (sp?) of the 
>> plowing
>> done by a keyline chisel plow.? I have never seen either a freshly
>>  completed keyline design,?nor such a design after several years
>> completion.? One thing that is not clear to me is how the chisel plow lines
>> hold up to the natural erosion that would seem to occur over time.? Swales
>> seem to have more resiliancy as they are?made on gradual sweeping lines 
>> that
>> have vegetative protection, whereas keyline chisel plow lines appear to
>> be?akin to defiles in the soil and more prone to collapse due to erosion
>> over time...with a resulting need to replow the?contour lines.? Any
>> corrections to my intuition are welcomed.
>> ?
>> John Fritz, NW Arkansas.
>>
>>
>>
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>> End of permaculture Digest, Vol 79, Issue 33
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