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  • From: Santoyo & Associates <santoyo@earthflow.com>
  • To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: [permaculture] Re: PC Design Charette Call Up
  • Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 11:12:22 -0700

Hello all,

I admit that I haven't been following this too closely but... I was just wondering a similar thing as John Shinerer below, not just about franks(soon to be)farm but several other developing sites... I have a few clients, and wanna be clients, that seem paralyzed by too much information. They end up looking for a fast cheap way to launch their projects and enterprises (and some don't even want to pay for the cheap way!)... that's fine, with me (I guess cause I have plenty of work) but it seems that part of what we are teaching is Bill's thing about "as soon as we start doing... we learn how to proceed." For me, (as much as I hate to admit that Bill was right about yet another thing!) this has been true more times than not, even with the best laid (or paid for) plans...

What I always recommend is first) if you don't want to pay for a consult -take a design course or two, or better yet, host one (every teacher I know has some kind of work trade or something to save students money and a host always makes out)... Second) go home and try something... third) THEN ask me again.

With all that energy going into it, instead of a charrette why don't you guys try the tried and true method of conducting a permaculture design course? I'll bet that in addition to empowering a whole classroom full of people, that, as a byproduct, all of Franks issues get solved too!.. not to mention, you'll be making/collecting capital and trade resources for you guys and for Frank's project...

Good luck,


Larry Santoyo
EarthFlow Design Works
San Luis Obispo, Ca
800.469.5857
www.earthflow.com


Aloha,

Not being shy, I've got a question for all potentially involved in
this:

Here's your chance to participate in a real world PC Design
Challenge on
a 450 farm preserve in beautiful south central Kentucky; and to help
demonstrate that PC can work on such a scale.
...
If we could get everyone together for 3-5 days we should be able to
gather
enough detailed observations to begin the PC Simulation in earnest
via a forum on the Internet.
...
So, don't be shy please let me hear from you soon. We'll need to do a
lot of preliminary planning, and coordination to make this work:)

For a while lately we've had a 'design charette' thread going on the
list for Frank's farm. What I've observed is this:

1) Frank, you ask lots of good questions relevant to PC designing for
your land.
2) List, we give him lots of good (or at least interesting and/or zany
:-) answers.
3) Frank, you are consistently appreciative of our feedback and input.
You also consistently write that in most cases you do not have one,
some or all of the time, money, person-power or equipment to implement
what you often agree are good design ideas on your fairly large spread.

4) Repeat from step 1) above.

My question is: what are y'all going to do differently before and/or
during getting together in person at Frank's place so that you don't
simply repeat the above pattern?

Assuming you don't want to just repeat it in person, that is. I
personally would find it rather frustrating, were I in the shoes of any
party to such a situation.


=====
John Schinnerer, MA
-------------------------
- Eco-Living -
Cultural & Ecological Designing
Food - Water - Shelter - Community - Technology
john@eco-living.net
http://eco-living.net

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