North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Nate <nrhora@gmail.com>]

Should add that you can always cut off their horns, and send them to
new pastures, as this can be beneficial to them too.

On 7/11/06, Nate <nrhora@gmail.com> wrote:
> Goats (on some level) probably have emotional states they go through
> from time to time, and sometimes they can ram their big horns into
> trunks of trees out of disgust for whatever is troubling them.
>
> Once they realize that they have done so, it's positively the case
> that they regret what they had done, and the farmer comes, removes the
> damn horns outta the tree, and the goat is once again happy.
>
> Surely, the goat after this time realizes it's mistake(s) (one can hope)
>
>
>
> On 7/11/06, oliver smith callis <oliversmithcallis@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I would just like to add that although some livestock ca adversely affect an
> > orchard or garden, others can be quite compatible. Geese and ducks, for
> > example, are excellent orchard weeders & fertilizers, and a chicken tractor
> > can work wonders in any backyard garden. I use chickens and ducks in my back
> > garden in a chicken tractor,
> > http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~nfantasi/Chicken%20Tractors.htm
> > to till soil for a garden bed rather than rent a rototiller plus I get eggs
> > in return. However it is true that with some animals, care has to be taken
> > to fence out younger trees and plants, but integrated systems can be
> > beneficial.
> >
> > Search for silvopasture on this page:
> > http://www.newfarm.org/international/features/0604/australia/index.shtml
> >    "In a silvopasture system the cattle, trees, and pasture exist in a
> > symbiotic relationship. The trees provide shade for the cattle, reducing
> > heat stress, compaction, and over fertilizing. In this subtropical climate,
> > Lindegger believes that the pasture also grows better in partial
> > shade...this system makes optimum use of the land."
> >
> > With goats one option is to plant a hedgerow to contain them with wire
> > netting on the side the goats are contained in so that they can trim the
> > hedge but not damage the plants. Another way of protecting trees is to
> > tether the goats to a pole so that they can't get to the trees, and
> > continuously move the pole so that the goat can get fresh browse. Here is an
> > example of one hedgerow-goat system
> > http://www.ibiblio.org/permaculture-online/profclogher03.html
> > http://www.ibiblio.org/permaculture-online/profclogher03.html
> >
> > related quotes:
> >
> > "As far as the living fences for the goats idea, Chris, well, I tried that
> > with a bunch of things that will grow from cutting. Coral trees, african
> > tulip and samea samans, and the goats debarked every post! So of course none
> > of them grew! I think the key is to have a "double fence", with some kind of
> > barrier between the hedge that is food for the goats and the goats! Perhaps
> > species can be chosen that have a drooping foliage so that the goats can
> > browse on what hangs down... "
> >
> > "Goat Person:
> >
> > Having been confused, bemused, abused, and misused by goats any number of
> > times in a long career on the farm, I shall venture the following:
> >
> > Goats are smarter than we are...they are more determined and prideful
> >
> > than we are, and they will get their way...
> >
> > In the present instance, your goats are psychically attuned to your
> > distress about the young nut trees and they are browsing upon them in
> > order to hurt you for, you write:
> >
> >
> > << I would like to put these animals to work>> HA! Goats cannot abide
> > this kind of thinking.
> >
> > If you could genuinely manage to transfer your affections to a prickly
> > pear cactus planting on the other side of a 40 foot high chain link fence
> >
> > and an active lava flow, your goats would go eat those and leave your
> > trees alone.
> >
> > Woody
> >
> >
> > On Sun, 28 Sep 1997 04:31:05 -0700 "Permaculture West"
> > <
> > permawest@olywa.net> writes:
> > > The farm I am caretaking has three rascally goats that are
> > >never content
> > >with what they are being fed or where they are being ranged
> > >(apparently
> > >typical for goats). I would like to put these animals to work as
> >
> > >pasture
> > >management agents around my newly planted nut trees. I have tried a
> > >number
> > >of caging devices to protect my trees but the goats have defied all my
> > >defenses and continue to ravage the young trees. This happens despite
> >
> > >the
> > >fact that they have abundant woody browse within their range. Has
> > >anyone
> > >stumbled across a clever way to protect their saplings from rampaging
> > >goats? Is there such a thing as a goat proof cage for trees? I get
> >
> > >the
> > >feeling the common answer will be, "don't range your goats with your
> > >young
> > >trees." However, unfortunately the two are already committed to
> > >eachother
> > >due to lack of space. "
> >
> >
> > I have been contemplating designing a goat forage system for my backyard and
> > it seems that there
> > must be a way to incorporate the benefits these animals bring and to utilize
> > their mischeviousness and intelligence.
> >
> >
> > some plants naturally browsed by goats are (from : "Permaculture Plants" by
> > Jeff Nugent & Julia Boniface)
> >
> > Nitrogen fixers-
> > Acacia cyclops (coastal wattle) - foliage
> > Alnus glutinosa (common or black alder)
> >  - foliage
> > Gleditsia triacanthos (Honey Locust) - pods
> >
> >
> > Others-
> > Simmondsia californica (Jojoba) - foliage
> >
> > Ziziphus mauritiana (Indian jujube) - foliage
> >
> > Ziziphus spina - christi (Christ thorn jujube) - fruit
> >
> >
> > Oliver
> >
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