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  • From: Cyndi Norman <cyndi AT tikvah.com>
  • To: market-farming AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Cc: , cyndi AT tikvah.com
  • Subject: Re: [Market-farming] Share Boxes (?)
  • Date: 26 Apr 2003 18:43:57 -0000

From: "Marlin Burkholder" <glenecofarm AT planetcomm.net>
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 19:38:37 -0700

> If your produce is certified organic packing in such boxes may well
> null and void you certification. Unless the food that came in the
> tomato boxes was certified organic (which is not that case at Burger
> King) the boxes will have been exposed to ag chemicals and it is
> assumed these chemicals still persist.

This and a few other reasons is precisely why we have never desired to
be certified organic! We do follow organic or sustainable practices for
most of the things we do here, but when it comes to questions of
nitpicking or operating under assumptions, common sense rules.

But whose version of common sense?

My common sense tells me that there will be actual pesticide, herbicide,
and/or fungicide transfer from non-organic boxes to your mostly organic
produce. The question is will it be enough to matter?

When we moved recently I sent my partner to the store to get used boxes and
when he brought home banana and apple boxes (non-organic) the pesticides
reeked so bad I couldn't have them in my house. I am disabled by multiple
chemical sensitivity and even small amounts of pesticides are enough to
make me ill for days or weeks. I had to have him put them outside.

My guess is that it wasn't so much that the produce was grown
non-organically but that the boxes themselves were sprayed, probably for
transport. I can eat non-organic produce if I don't do it too often and be
okay. The problem was the more recent residues right there in the
cardboard. Another issue with boxes is what they are stored with. I can't
handle boxes that were stored next to fabric softener, say.

So what about Burger King tomato boxes? Are these clean cardboard that
held nothing but conventually grown tomatoes? Or were the boxes sprayed in
the delivery trucks, in various storage facilities, or permeated with
preservatives to keep the tomatoes "fresh?" How would you know? Or maybe
the boxes picked up something at the Burger King itself. They likely use
pesticides in the store. I would hope they have enough sense not to spray
around boxes with food in them, but what about the place where your friend
is saving those empty boxes for you?

I'm not trying to discourage you from the praiseworthy goal of recycling or
from using these particular boxes. They are probably just fine. My point
is this: rules that seem overly picky or arbitrary are there for a reason.

I have new applicant status with my organic certifier (CCOF) and the rule
that gets me is having to use only organic seedlings, seeds, plants, etc.
I don't mind switching my commercial sources but what if a friend gives me
a plant or if I pick something up at the California Rare Fruit Growers or a
local plant sale? There are legit ways of getting around these rules (and
it's fairly easy for trees and perennials that take at least a year to
produce) but they are restrictive.

Cyndi


_______________________________________________________________________________
Petaluma, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 15 Sunset Western Garden
Guide
Chemically sensitive/disabled - Organic Gardening only by choice and
neccessity
_______________________________________________________________________________
Cyndi
Norman
Handcrafted organic soaps & cosmetics
cyndi AT tikvah.com
Organic bedding, safety equipment
http://www.tikvah.com/
_________________ Owner of the Immune Website & Lists
http://www.immuneweb.org/
>From cyndi AT tikvah.com Sat Apr 26 14:51:04 2003
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From: Cyndi Norman <cyndi AT tikvah.com>
To: mjbosko AT jmtsystems.com
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Subject: Re: [Market-farming] New guy Introduction (+ weed question)
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From: "Mike Bosko" <mjbosko AT jmtsystems.com>
Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:05:46 -0700

I've weaned the fields off of all chemicals since we bought the place 4
years ago

Congrats.

Okay, again, to my question.... Knowing that the weeds that grow in a
given area help explain imbalances in soil, does anyone know of a good
source (web site would be ideal) that talks about what weeds grow in
what conditions? Having descriptions of the plants and even better,
pictures would be awesome. I've searched many times over and haven't
found such a site. I've seen noxious weed sites for my State, but all
they do is tell what the plants are, and how to eradicate them. I want
to know what soil conditions they thrive in, so I can make appropriate
changes. And yes, I still need to get soil samples sent in for testing
- but it would be nice to be able to get an idea from the plants that
grow.

Not a website but a fantastic book. By Robert Kourik.
Designing and Maintaining Your Edible Landscape Naturally.
He has an entire chapter and chart on the very subject you want. Not to
mention hundreds of others. Worth owning.

Cyndi

_______________________________________________________________________________
Petaluma, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 15 Sunset Western Garden
Guide
Chemically sensitive/disabled - Organic Gardening only by choice and
neccessity
_______________________________________________________________________________
Cyndi
Norman
Handcrafted organic soaps & cosmetics
cyndi AT tikvah.com
Organic bedding, safety equipment
http://www.tikvah.com/
_________________ Owner of the Immune Website & Lists
http://www.immuneweb.org/
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To: "'Market Farming'" <market-farming AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: RE: [Market-farming] multiple crops
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 17:43:59 -0500
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Makes me want to get forty or fifty kinds of seeds then mix them all
together and throw them all into the garden just to see what happens.
Plethora, nice word----
Bob C

My beds are a plethora of intercropping. We are planting petunias with the
beans, radish with beetberry and spinach, nasturtium with the cabbage,
parsley with the tomatoes, Scallions with the beets Carrots and Leeks,
Marigolds with the potatoes, and the list goes on. I am also using border
trap crops of bouquet dill.
www.IdleThymeFarm.com




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Plethora, nice word----<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle17><font size=3D2 =
color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Bo=
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