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Subject: Development of Creative Commons licenses

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  • From: drew Roberts <zotz AT>
  • To: Discussion on the Creative Commons license drafts <cc-licenses AT>
  • Subject: Re: [cc-licenses] Founders as a module? was Re: Getting to Version 3.0
  • Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 22:52:30 -0400

On Wednesday 24 May 2006 10:17 pm, Greg London wrote:
> Doug,
> I get it. And I don't think it's CC's fault, really.
> I don't think the seqence is
> License->Works->Project
> I think its more like:
> Project->License->Works.
> i.e. I don't think the license by itself will create
> the sort of repository of images, photos, and audio
> that someone can go to for whatever they might be
> doing.
> I think someone comes up with an idea for a project,
> the license enables all works to be compatible with
> one another, and then people create the works.
> I get that all the metadata, hyper-tagging, super
> searching, is intended to get around this, by letting
> Alice put a single photo up under CC-BY and Bob
> can find it via super-google for a completely unrelated
> project, but I don't think it's there yet, and I'm not sure
> its a technical issue.

It may or may not be a technical issue, but I agree completely that it is not
there yet. When I go searching for BY-SA music, I mostly get BY-SA licensed
webpages discussing "all rights reserved" music. This makes such searches
mostly useless.

> I don't think it gives people
> the focus they need to know in what direction they
> are being asked to contribute.
> Wikipedia is a directed project that also happens to
> work well for incremental additions, and separate
> articles encourage even minor contributions. and
> the whole thing scales unbelievably easily because
> people simply go to the articles they're interested
> in and contribute.
> I've yet to see a media creation site that is CC-SA
> that has the short term goal that allows people
> to see some immediate results and has a long term
> goal that inspires people to contribute. The other
> issue is it needs to be "chunk-able". small contributions
> need to be enabled somehow, and I don't know that
> anyone's figured out how to do that.

OK, here is an idea I have been kicking around for a while.

Take Ardour:

Get them to make the changes so that CC license info could be included in
track in a project.

Record a song with individual tracks. release as an ardour project file.

This is then chunkable.

A person can simply do a different mixdown.

A person can add a new track.

A person can replace a track.

A person can drop the vocals and sing new words.

A person can add harmonies to the chorus.

A harmonica player can add a lick or two here and there.

People can drop their instrument trakc and jam with the song for practice.

I could go on.
> And media and any other sort of "art" seems to be
> a lot bloody harder to do than the pure funcationality
> of a project like Linux or a more fact-oriented project
> like wikipedia. I was at a fiction-writer's conference
> once and a commercial publisher in a discussion panel
> said "Your first half million words are practice".
> That doesn't enable minor contributions from a large
> body of people. That limits the contributing population
> and therefore requires a lot more work from each individual.

That is probably a rule of thum for novels. And while in the traditional
model, those first half a million might be good for nothing else other than
their practice value, under a copyleft model, there may be other values.

For instance, while I don't think Tings has much chance as is:

I do think there are some parts in there that can be put to good use. If I
ever get organised, I have a thousand dollars of my own money set aside to
experiment with that belief.
Record a song and you might win $1,000.00)
> These are problems that need to be solved before
> you'll be able to have a site of music, images,
> video, and text, that you can roll into your video.
> And none of them are solvable by a license.
> This problem is like a door with
> about six locks on it, and when CC created
> their spectrum of licenses, it unlocked one
> of the locks. But that key doesn't fit the other
> locks.
> > I thought I might remove all the copywrited stuff add CC music and
> > pictures and put it on line free under CC. I am finding it almost
> > impossible to find stuff that I can use because so many pictures film
> > clips and music have different conditions for use. I also have not
> > been able to figure out if it's ok to give credit on a separate page
> > at the end of the cd. I am beginning to think that CC is not practical
> > for use in something like I am trying to do. Seems like there should
> > be a different search engine for each different type of license. If
> > not yet down the road someplace.

all the best,

Record a song and you might win $1,000.00

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