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  • From: Day Brown <daybrown AT hypertech.net>
  • To: baslinux AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [BL] Running jmce
  • Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 22:51:42 +0000

James Miller wrote:

> > But if then BASICLINUX can fire up a GUI browser, that's all I need. I'm
> > not trying to run a network.
> >
> "486," "30 pin dram" and "Mozilla" do not belong together in the same
> sentence. Steven runs Mozilla on a BL2 install, but that's on a P 166
> with 64MB RAM. That's probably close to the bottom end in terms of system
> resources required to make Mozilla run tolerably. I guess 32MB RAM
> *might* work, though I haven't tried it. If you wanna try Mozilla on a
> 486, it better be a DX4 100-120 with 64MB RAM. I can assure you that with
> anything less you'll be totally exasperated. Lesser systems have run
> Opera 6.03 for some on this list, though 32MB RAM should probably be a
> minimum there for reasonable performance. I tried Opera 6.12 on a 486
> DX2 66 with 20MB RAM (30 pin simms) and it was quite an exercise in
> patience. I don't think I could put up with it on a routine basis. To
> get around the multi-user stuff in BL, you could always set up your
> machine to automatically log you in as root user. I've forgotten which
> init script one edits to get this, though I'm sure Steven has that
> information ready-to-hand. That way, you'll never get asked for username
> and password that way, and you'll have full rights to do whatever you want
> with anything on the system.

Thanx for the Tips James, but if a platform cant run a GUI browser online w/
56k, then its prolly headed for the landfill. I'll keep one running as a test
bed for hardware, but without net access, I cant give them away, much less
sell any. I am delighted to see BASICLINUX access crashed Linux drives and
CDs.although I can do that with DOS LTOOLS.

But more than that, the idea of a cumulative build of a Linux terminal module
by module looks more like the familiar DOS process with CONFIG.SYS &
AUTOEXEC.BAT. When something dont work, its easy to see where the problems
start. It's been about 5 years since my first linux attempt with RH 5 on a
486 w/8meg dram, and boy was that a learning experience. It ran, but... what
a dog. Seeing BOOT.BAT bring up bash so quickly was a much more gratifying
experience.

Part of my complaint with Linux has been this attitude of throw-it-all on the
drive hoping that none of it crashes. I sponze Linux is great for network
sysads, but for the single user, the code bloat goes way beyond just the
logon/paasword/permission process. I remember trying to use 'man/info' for a
doc file with RH 5, and going away for a lunch break while it searched thru
umpteenth megs of text files, most of which includes vast amounts of data
that only a network sysad needs to know. And almost every time I tried to
install a download, I ran into 'dependancy' problems, which I see are among
the current threads here... and on virtually every Linux list I have ever
seen.

I saw the instructions to get xwin running on BASICLINUX, which included
downloading one set of 6 files and then a seventh from another link. With a
dos program, that was *never* a problem. If 6 files were needed, they were
all zipped up in the same archive. The DOS ARACHNE install included scores of
files which were all sorted by the script into their appropriate
subdirectories, and then the SETUP.EXE went into routines to establish the
speed of the platform and the video. Whereas the Linux xwin setup suggests
alternatives if you want something more than 640x480, and this presumably
would be made available to every gui app, ARACHNE worked out the VESA or
whatever drivers itself.

I dunno why Mozilla or Opera couldna done the same thing, looked at the os
and hardware, and tweaked to accmodate its own agenda rather than
'dependancies' that might or might not be there, and might or might not work
appropriately. Another thing that a heavy app might do, is to then remove
all the files and subroutines that are not needed for that particular setup.
Without that, what I see is scores of files in every directory, which adds up
to a lotta clutter, and slows down the interface as the software tries to
find the right set to work with.

It is one of the beaties of BASICLINUX that there are so few files that it
dont spend lotsa time looking for the right ones to work with. Since I had
the SLACKWARE 7.1 CDs, I was able to find the 6 files mentioned for xwin, but
it was gonzo easier to do using DOS DW.EXE [Directory Wizard file manager] to
tag them for copying. But I couldnt find xf86config on the CD. Here again, a
comparison.

I've run DOS for 20 years, but it dont take long to get a handle on DOS batch
programming. I wish I could do the xf86config scripting in it cause Linux
curses is way to complex to deal with. But time and again on the Linux lists
I've seen where someone, mainly MANDRAKE users, wanted to get the video setup
right.... but having to fool with the mouse and kybd menus every time is just
time wasting. It is routine in DOS to be able to back out of a setup menu one
step at a time, but if you need to go back in xf86config, you havta start all
over. I see the same thing in the GUI desktop settings, repeatedly having
relaunch CONTROL PANEL or whatever if I dont like a particular setting.

The 'esc' key in dos usually just brings you back one menu screen, but in
Linux it closes the whole thing down. I think its the result of sysad
mentality, where users are not allowed to monkey around with the settings,
which the sysad makes for a whole set of terminals. He does it once for
everyone, and they like it or lump it. But unlike the single user at his own
desktop, the sysad is a 'professional' who is more familiar with what he
wants everyone to have. Me, I'm always tweaking, which is one of the reasons
I'm trying BASICLINUX. I expect to have a much better idea of what is setup,
and why.

I've followed the advice seen online to change init settings for automatic
logon to the gui, but I've also seen that whatever distro I was running wasnt
*exactly* like what was cited, and I ended up with yet another trashed
install.





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