Biblical Hebrew Forum

[David Kolinsky <hadeesh AT sbcglobal.net>]

yes Nir, that is exactly what I wanted to say.

Thank You,
David Kolinsky
Monterey CA

---

From: Nir cohen - Prof. Mat. <nir AT ccet.ufrn.br>
To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Sent: Mon, November 12, 2012 7:22:16 AM
Subject: [b-hebrew] BZH

ishinan,

first, please note that my conjectured etymology (and i believe, also david's)
distinguishes between three different semitic roots: BZZ (loot),
BZH/BZW (despise), and the bisyllabic BZ/BD (set aside).

secondly, i am afraid you are missing here a very natural cognitive association:

BZ=set aside --> take away --> take by force --> loot=BZZ

[along with a second association

BZ=set aside --> discriminate/look down upon --> despise=BZH.]

based on these, the natural conjecture is indeed that BZ/BD led to
both BZZ and BZH/BZW by a natural process of etymological shift,
where a NEUTRAL/GENERIC term specifies into a more concrete term.

as david hinted in his last email, similar processes within semitics
(or NWS) may have led to BDL, BDH, BDD, BZR, PDH, among others.

nir cohen

>>>De: "Ishnian" <ishinan AT comcast.net>
>>>nir: david, ishinan,  BZH is also used in hebrew as "loot, spoils (n)"
which seems to agree  with david's arabic "to set aside (v)".
-------------------------------
 
>>> ishinan: Since the Arabic verb is from the trilateral root "bzz", it never
means: "to set aside".
Rather it means: he took it away or seized it or carried away by force, he
took it away unjustly and forcibly. Hence, it is said in a well known proverb:
He who overcomes, takes the spoils (Arabic: man `azza bazza). This is in
agreement with the Hebrew 'bazaz' (962); plunder:--booty, prey, spoil(-ed). 

Even then, I fail to see how David's proposed Arabic definitions of "set
aside" (which BTW are wrong) could lead to the sense of  "spoil"  (see the
definitions of "set aside" * below and judge for yourself )




--------------------------------
*set aside
1 reserve something: to keep something, especially time or money, for a
specific purpose
2 put something to one side: to put something to one side
3 reject previous decision: to discard, reject, or annul a previous decision
or judgment
--------------------------------


Note we are discussing in this exchange *TWO* different Hebrew roots.

1) bzz : to spoil, plunder  (see Brown Driver Briggs # 962 p. 102)

2) bza: raise the head loftily and disdainfully, hence despise, regard with
contempt  (see Brown Driver Briggs # 959 p. 102)



Best regards,

Ishinan Ishibashi
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