Biblical Hebrew Forum

["K Randolph" <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>]

Pere:
We are now going in circles. The question I brought up, can RWC be used in a
transitive manner? If so, then the niphal is possible.

Are there examples where RWC is used in a transitive manner? I brought up 2
Samuel 22:30 where it appears that it can be. If this truly is a transitive
use of RWC, then the niphal use elsewhere cannot be ruled out.

Does RWC have the same meaning as "run" in English, a verb that can be used
either as an intransitive and transitive verb? The answer is no, but it is
very similar.

Then you haven't dealt with the contextual clues that indicate motion
towards, and RWC is the only verb that indicates motion of the verbs that
can have the morphology found in the verse.

For me, the combination of context indicating motion, morphology, word
meanings and that RWC can be used in a transitive manner, all combine to
make RWC the most likely candidate for the verb.

A final point is that the Bible is a relatively small book to use to define
the limits of a language. When a document as small as the Gezar calendar can
have at least one word not found in the Bible, how many other words were
there in common use that never made it to the Bible? How many other uses of
words found in the Bible other than those extant were there in the spoken
and written language? When the last unquestionably native speaker having
died two and a half millennia ago, we can't answer these questions.
Therefore, you cannot rule out the niphal use of RWC.

Karl W. Randolph.

On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 9:18 PM, <pporta AT oham.net> wrote:
>
> Yes, Karl.
> From an English viewpoint this is as you write. But from a Hebrew
> viewpoint it is wrong.
> The Hebrew view of the sentence is:
> "The snake oil salesman was caused to run out of the town"
> Namely, the Huph'al and not the Niph'al of "run".
> I mean: the right word  --if we should to translate the sentence into
> Hebrew-- would not the Niph'al of RWC, but the Huph'al of RWC. Look at B.2
> in  www.oham.net/out/P-d/P-d083.html
> and remark the examples taken from the Bible.
> I suggest you to take advice whether the Niph'al of RWC really exists.
>

The hophal indicates that the person left under his own power, as in "he was
caused to run out of town". However, in American usage, particularly in
stories from the frontier from 150 years ago, "run out" could be after being
tarred and feathered, then carried out on a pole. In such a use, the hophal
does not fit.

>
> Warm greetings!
>
> Pere Porta
>
>