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  • From: Uri Hurwitz <uhurwitz AT yahoo.com>
  • To: Peter Kirk <peterkirk AT qaya.org>
  • Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] David or Elhanan?
  • Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 08:00:27 -0800 (PST)



Peter Kirk <peterkirk AT qaya.org> wrote:
On 27/01/2005 22:57, Uri Hurwitz wrote:

> Hi Brian, if you recheck your sources you'll see that David does not at all
> mean "champion"; this is simply a conjecture derived from a non-Semitic
> language, and has not been substantiated., Nobody knows what the name
> means; the two other possibilities from the HB do not make sense.
>
>

Doesn't it make sense to derive the name DWD (sometimes DWYD) from the
well-attested root DWD/YDD "love", so that it is effectively a doublet
of the common noun DWD (pronounced dod) "beloved, uncle"? I agree that
this derivation is not certain, but it does seem to make sense.



----In that case one would expect some a theophoric PN such as either * DWD)L
or

*)LDWD or the attested Yedidyah. This or other possibilities
such as as "pot, big kettle" or "uncle" are unacceptable; or uncertain as
you agreee.

> Solomon is derived from the root peace ( the same you use, in the Arabic
> pl.form, in the closing of your letters!).

----my aside in parenthesis was a direct result of the devil causing me
to misremember Brian's customary closing incorrectly as "salamat", which is
the regular fem. plural ending in Arabic.

--- Let me hasten to add here that the original meaning of $LM is"
wholeness, completeness", and "peace" is a scondarey derivatioin.
>

>
> No matter how the slightly different narratives developed around Goliat in
> Samuel and Chronicles, in the both he is described hailing from Gath, one
> of the Philistine pentapolis centers. I don't see therefore the need for
> Goliat one, and Goliat two.
>
>
>
I think there is some confusion here between Karl and Brian, compounded
by a failure to recognise that in every case (1 Samuel 17:4, 2 Samuel
21:19, 1 Chronicles 20:5) Goliath is said to be from Gath (or
equivalently a Gittite).

---- that was my point exactly, but obviously we interpret the same
point differently, my view is quoted in the previous mailing above.

---- further, sorry if I confused Karl and Brian mailings, both clearly
distinct individuals , as were David and Elhanan.

Uri

--










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>From peterkirk AT qaya.org Fri Jan 28 11:26:18 2005
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To: Uri Hurwitz <uhurwitz AT yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] David or Elhanan?
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On 28/01/2005 16:00, Uri Hurwitz wrote:

>
>
> */Peter Kirk <peterkirk AT qaya.org>/* wrote:
>
> ...
> Doesn't it make sense to derive the name DWD (sometimes DWYD) from
> the
> well-attested root DWD/YDD "love", so that it is effectively a
> doublet
> of the common noun DWD (pronounced dod) "beloved, uncle"? I agree
> that
> this derivation is not certain, but it does seem to make sense.
>
>
>
> ----In that case one would expect some a theophoric PN such as
> either * DWD)L or
>
> *)LDWD or the attested Yedidyah. ...
>

Well, maybe, but there are other attested cases of what were presumably
originally theophoric names of this kind which have lost their
theophoric elements. I can think immediately of Nathan, presumably an
abbreviation of Nathan'el or Nathanyahu. There are many others. So why
not David?

--
Peter Kirk
peter AT qaya.org (personal)
peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
http://www.qaya.org/



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