Biblical Hebrew Forum

["UUC" <unikom AT paco.net>]

Dear Liz,

Is52:11 has nothing to do with the holy vessels.
clei is earthenware, cheap and unimportant. In this context, clei is weapons
of the Almighty. Military connotation is evidenced by the next verse,
assuring of the divine help.

But anyway, I don't take Prophets and Writings as you seems to do, as
chronologic record. They are not.


> In Isaiah 52 we read of the temple vessels being brought back to
> Zion. In Ezra we again read of the temple vessels being counted
> out by Cyrus. Are you saying they were never returned? I
> don't read the return of the vessels as a prophesy but rather as something
> that was taking place before the eyes of the prophet and of all the world.
> So, on what basis do you say that they weren't returned?
> There is, in fact, no actual mention in Ezra of the vessels actually being
> placed
> in the temple, but that seems a flimsy basis to assume that they weren't
> returned.
> I view the return of the vessels as the physical embodiment of YHWH's
return
> to Zion. It is not just the rebuilding of the temple and the restoration
of
> the people and the vessels to it, but really the restoration of YHWH
himself
> to his temple
> and to his city that makes Cyrus the Messiah. This was fullfilled. The
> promise is laid out in Isaiah 40 and its fulfillment is described in
Isaiah
> 52.
> See my article "Cyrus the Messiah? The Historical Background of
> Isaiah 45:1"  Harvard Theological Review 95 (2002): 373-393.
> Liz
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > [mailto:b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of UUC
> > Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 11:42 AM
> > To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Isaiah 53 read within the book as a whole
> >
> > Dear Liz,
> >
> > We have predictions in Is52, and then a person appears
> > executed. He didn't fulfill the prophet's expectations.
> >
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Vadim
> >
> >
> > > Why do you say the predictions of the previous chapters
> > were unfulfilled?
> > > Liz
> > > You wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Dear David,
> > > >
> > > > >To this I would insist we add that
> > > > any ?final reading| must make sense within the book read as a
> > > > whole.< Actually, I suggest that Isaiah 53 was interpolated by a
> > > > hand attempting to imitate Isaiah' and Job's style to explain why
> > > > the prophecy of the previous
> > > > chapter(s) was unfulfilled. So 53 doesn't fit semantically by
> > > > definition.
> > >
> > >
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>
>
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