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  • From: furuli AT online.no
  • To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Re: nephesh mot
  • Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 16:54:29 +0200

Dear Peter,

I note that you do not entirely agree with the saying that a word has no meaning without a context. But you did not answer my questions regarding the three Hebrew words I mentioned. Such an answer could reveal the degree of your agreement/disagreement with the mentioned saying.

In many posts the concept "meaning" is in focus, and if it is not focused upon it is lurking in the background. In 1923 Samuel Ogden wrote the book "The Meaning of Meaning", and after him others have discussed the subject. If we use the word *meaning* without having a definite definition in mind, it may be time to study this subject in depth.

Please look at the four propositions below (I use "substantive" instead of "word" to restrict the issue a little):

1) A substantive has no meaning without a context.
2) A substantive has no reference without a context.

3) NEPE$ has no meaning without a context.
4) NEPE$ has no reference without a context.

I can hardly think that any linguist would equate "meaning" and "reference. So my question is: Do 1) and 2) say the same thing or is there a difference? And I ask the same question regarding 3) and 4).

Jo Sprinkle gave a list of how the NASB has rendered NEPE$:
any 1, anyone 2, anyone* 1, appetite 7, being 1, beings 3,
body 1, breath 1, corpse 2, creature 6, creatures 3, dead 1, dead person 2,
deadly 1, death 1, defenseless* 1, desire 12, desire* 2, discontented* 1,
endure* 1, feelings 1, fierce* 2, greedy* 1, heart 5, heart's 2, herself 12,
Himself 4, himself 19, human 1, human being 1, hunger 1, life 146, life* 1,
lifeblood* 2, lives 34, living creature 1, longing* 1, man 4, man's 1, men*
2, mind 2, Myself 3, myself 2, number 1, ones 1, others 1, ourselves 3, own
1, passion* 1, people 2, people* 1, perfume* 1, person 68, person* 1,
persons 19, slave 1, some 1, soul 238, soul's 1, souls 12, strength 1,
themselves 6, thirst 1, throat 2, will 1, wish 1, wishes 1, yourself 11,
yourselves 13

Do these renderings indicate that NEPE$ has different *meanings*, or are most of them just *references*? So again, what actually is *meaning* inside the frame of lexical semantics? Which place do the mental lexicon play in relation to *meaning*? I think these questions are extremely important, because *meaning* i relation to Hebrew words so often is discussed, whereas many writers are not conscious about the meaning of meaning.


Best regards

Rolf Furuli


On 25/08/2003 05:18, furuli AT online.no wrote:


Dear Peter,

I have often wondered if those who say that a word does not have meaning without a context (or is "meaningless without specific textual contexts,") have for themselves defined the key word they are using, namely, *meaning* . Therefore I ask you. Is "meaning" the same as "reference", or is it "concept", or is it something else?

Would you really say that the bare Hebrew words such as $eleg ("snow"), )i$ ("man") and QF+AL "kill" are without *meaning*, like the word gobbledygook written in Hebrew characters would have been for the Hebrew mind? If these words have meaning without a context, would not the same be true with NEPE$?

Best regards

Rolf Furuli

about words being "meaningless without specific textual contexts".


Well, actually I was not entirely agreeing with Jim on this. My point was that the meaning of a word like "soul" apart from a specific textual context may be quite unrelated to the meaning of it in a particular context in the Bible. If you ask some people what "soul" means out of context they will refer to a style of music. But if the same people read this word in context in the Bible, they will understand it in a totally different sense. Not meaningless out of context, but misleading out of context, which is potentially worse. If people know something is meaningless, they know they have to look elsewhere for the meaning. If something seems meaningful but the meaning is incorrect, people don't realise that they are misunderstanding.

--
Peter Kirk
peter AT qaya.org (personal)
peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
http://www.qaya.org/





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