Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Dave Washburn" <dwashbur AT nyx.net>]

Shoshanna,
> > > On Hebrew Grammar
> > >
> > > On the fact that the same word is used AS a future tense word in other
> > > places in the Torah
> >
> > But not always or only as future.  The prefix conjugation serves
> > both purposes.
> 
> 
> Please, then cite an example from some OTHER place in the Torah, where
> "Ehyeh" is not future

Not in the Torah proper, but in 2 Sam 15:34 it's past.  2 Sam 16:18 
appears to be present.  See also Isaiah 3:7; Ps 50:21; Ruth 2:13; 
Song of Songs 1:7.  In addition, nearly all occurrences of the word 
are in formulae such as "I will be their God" (ehyeh lahem lelohim) 
and such.  I wasn't able to find another instance where it's used 
absolutely like this.  So there are a couple of things wrong with 
your question: a) there are no exact parallels, and b) you limit it 
only to the Torah when we need to be looking at the whole of the 
Tanakh.

> In the very same chapter, Exodus 3:12  Ehyeh is definitely used in the
> future tense.  It is not characteristic of the Torah to be careless about
> the words, and combinations of letters used - rather the opposite.

But it's in another formula, 'ehyeh `immak.  So that doesn't really 
tell us anything about the 'ehyeh asher 'ehyeh phrase.

> > > On the fact that, Biblical Hebrew is still Hebrew, and not some other
> > > language
> >
> > But modern Hebrew is based more on Mishnaic than biblical
> > Hebrew (evidence e.g. the lack of the waw-consecutive form).
> > Mishnaic Hebrew developed into a tensed language, whereas
> > biblical Hebrew seems to be something different.
> 
> 
> Not to me, when I read it

Then you're reading it anachronistically.  Mishnaic Hebrew, 
followed by modern Hebrew, created a tensed language that uses 
the prefix conjugation for future, the participle for present and the 
suffix for past.  But a simple glance at the Tanakh shows that 
those writers knew of no such system.

> > > If someone would remind me where exactly this pasuk (Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh)
> is,
> > > in the Torah, I will see if I can find if any of the commentaries
> comment on
> > > this.
> >
> > Exodus 3.
> 
[snip]
> I really don't see how anyone can claim that they know better than the great
> Torah commentators, which are far more numerous than what I just quoted,
> none of whom, I can assure you, believe that "Ehyeh" means 'I am'

Do we really think that our knowledge of biblical Hebrew grammar 
hasn't advanced a bit since medieval times?  Those giants did the 
best they could with the knowledge they had, but their grasp of 
biblical grammar was flawed at best.  That doesn't mean their 
comments are worthless, of course, but it does mean we need to 
check them against what we now know about grammar and 
especially the verb system.  So citing them uncritically doesn't get 
us anywhere, nor does citing them show that I am "simply wrong" 
as you said in another post.  It means they were operating from an 
incorrect premise of grammar.  'ehyeh COULD mean "I will be," but 
that doesn't mean it ALWAYS carried that meaning.  I've given 
several passages where it has to carry present meaning, and even 
one that is past.  The picture is nowhere near as simple as you 
suggest.


Dave Washburn
http://www.nyx.net/~dwashbur
"You just keep thinking, Butch.  That's what you're good at."