permaculture

[Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com>]

My reply to Mike:

On Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 8:37 AM, Michael Elvin <marimike6@yahoo.com> wrote:

> The water-borne wastes produced in the fish ponds could be filtered out by
> a solar-powered pump. The solids could be mucked up from the floor by a
> hand-powered rotating boom,
>

If the water in the fish ponds can be kept in motion, allowing for
suspension of nutrient-containing solids, it can be simply pumped to
other areas for remediation and use as plant food, using solar or wind
powered pumps, of course. In the case of the African project, the brine
shrimp lagoon was contained in an area higher than the agricultural fields
(maybe they were at the same elevation and tides were used to move effluent
to the fields). The shrimp were caught in nets (a weir would be used for
fish production) and the dam would be opened to allow flow of effluent to
the fields.

Another method which is sometimes used in hog or poultry waste lagoons is
to place a large specially designed sump pump into the depths or on the
bottom of the lagoon to recirculate nutrient rich water with lots of
sediment, silt and organic matter, which would become putrifactive
otherwise, the worst thing that can happen if you're trying to reclaim
those nutrients to recycle as plant fertilizer, and push it to the surface.
These pumps move liquid effluent to the surface to be oxygenated and spread
throughout the lagoon so that aerobic remediation and conversion of raw
nutrients to plant available ones can occur. Elaine Ingham has done work in
this field. This info is based on one of her posts on the subject I read
years ago.

easy to design if your pond was round and had a concrete floor. (Mucking
> out standard poly-sheeted bottoms by hand is among life's most tedious
> chores.) These solids, a nuisance in the fishpond and a reservoir of
> pathogens, become gold when applied to vegetable patches.
>


>
> What I'm describing is a newer iteration of the *chinampa *system,
> developed by Middle Americans several thousand years ago. They began with
> fish ponds, then mucked out the bottoms and threw the muck up on the banks,
> creating a patch to grow veggies. After a few years you have a mature
> system, producing profuse quantities of fish, shrimp and vegetables, and
> maintained by just shoveling out the muck.
>

They probably use systems similar to this in Vietnam.
Sounds logical. I did not know that they moved nutrient rich silt and
organic matter from the bottoms of the ponds or ditches, but of course they
did.

On Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 10:37 AM, Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com>
wrote:

>
> On Fri, Jun 5, 2015 at 10:18 AM, christopher nesbitt <
> christopher.nesbitt@mmrfbz.org> wrote:
>
> there is a place for aquaponics in a field as broad as permaculture.
>
>
> My friend Mike sent me this today to x-post here:
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Michael Elvin <marimike6@yahoo.com>
> Date: Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 8:37 AM
> Subject: aquaponics & hydroponics
>
> I think 'Steve' is mistaken in his take on aquaponics and hydroponics.
>
> Permaculture addresses the best ways of encouraging the world's bounty to
> be maximally productive. That is, to devise systems where the various
> energies combine so that all the elements sustain each other-- that is, so
> that the inputs of one organism match the outputs of another. That's the
> way I look at it-- and that's the way I think it works best. What it
> describes is a community of living organisms, co-existing in a state of
> mutual benefit. Such a state stimulates biodiversity.
>
> So what's wrong with hydroponics? Here you have a prime medium in which to
> grow various foods: sunlight, water and space to grow all coexist. The only
> task is to figure out what nutrients are also required by your target crop.
>
> It would seem an ideal approach to producing masses, for example, of
> chlorella, spirulina and other nutritious blue-green algae species. These
> in turn could serve as vital foods for humans and farm animals alike. They
> test higher in basic nutrient content than most other foods known to us.
> The only limit lies in developing methods to grow these substances in
> massive quantity-- heretofore they have only been marketed as food
> supplements, available only in tiny, expensive packets. You'd want to try
> to bring the price down to two to three bucks a pound. It's a problem in
> search of better solutions.
>
> Spirulina is 65-71 percent complete protein compared to beef, which is
> only 22 percent, and lentils, which is only 26 percent.
>
> Spirulina: The Amazing Super Food You've Never Heard of
>
> http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/07/01/spirulina-the-amazing-super-food-youve-never-heard-of.aspx
> Spirulina is a blue-green freshwater algae that is rich in protein and can
> help boost your immune system and regulate cholesterol and blood pressure
> levels.
> View on articles.mercola.com
>
> IMHO, a hydroponic system producing quantities of spirulina or chlorella
> would be a natural base for, say, shrimp or fish ponds.  So you would have
> a hydroponic system supporting an aquacultural system. The water-borne
> wastes produced in the fish ponds could be filtered out by a solar-powered
> pump. The solids could be mucked up from the floor by a hand-powered
> rotating boom, easy to design if your pond was round and had a concrete
> floor. (Mucking out standard poly-sheeted bottoms by hand is among life's
> most tedious chores.) These solids, a nuisance in the fishpond and a
> reservoir of pathogens, become gold when applied to vegetable patches.
>
> What I'm describing is a newer iteration of the chinampa system, developed
> by Middle Americans several thousand years ago. They began with fish ponds,
> then mucked out the bottoms and threw the muck up on the banks, creating a
> patch to grow veggies. After a few years you have a mature system,
> producing profuse quantities of fish, shrimp and vegetables, and maintained
> by just shoveling out the muck.
>
> Sounds very permacultural to me. You have my permission to pass this
> concept on to any who might use it.
>
> --
> Lawrence F. London
> lfljvenaura@gmail.com
> Ello: @ecoponderosa <https://ello.co/ecoponderosa>
> https://sites.google.com/site/avantgeared/
> https://sites.google.com/site/venaurafarm/
>
>
>
>


-- 
Lawrence F. London
lfljvenaura@gmail.com
Ello: @ecoponderosa <https://ello.co/ecoponderosa>
https://sites.google.com/site/avantgeared/
https://sites.google.com/site/venaurafarm/