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permaculture - Re: [permaculture] Whitewash Bob's Roof Day plus Mapping/data site find story on white roofs impacts

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  • From: "John D'hondt" <dhondt@eircom.net>
  • To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] Whitewash Bob's Roof Day plus Mapping/data site find story on white roofs impacts
  • Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2012 23:05:10 +0100


Same thing here Bob,
I know that my father and grandfather knew things they never passed on that might be usefull to me now.
Then again I also know that not all that old wisdom was wise or usefull. My maternal grandmother was convinced that small birds and especially tits (insectivores) were responsible for bringing "vermin"/aphids to vegetables in summer. I am fairly certain the tits only showed up between vegetables because there were aphids there for them to eat. I can not see them deliberately importing them.
My mother also did not like small birds so that meme must have been going around for some few generations. There are similar things. In the 18th century all the great biologists thought that swallows hibernated at the bottom of local lakes and ponds and it took over a hundred years to change that idea.

But there are a universe of modern ideas that have an army of defenders that will be thought idiotic in a hundred years time but that for now stand firm even if many people already can see where they fail. I am thinking in the first place about the whole chemical industry. It is almost impossible to cook up any complex chemical molecule without creating a soup of stereo isomers that nothing in nature can effectively deal with.

It is easy to create glucose out of very simple molecules such as methane and water in a lab. But only part of what you made will be identical to glucose made in plants (D glucose). About half of your product will be the mirror immage of L glucose that very few organisms can metabolise.
With enormously more complex molecules you can end up with a soup of a dozen or more isomers and I think that is the reason that most pesticides and herbicides are so persistent in the environment. It is also the main reason that modern medicine makes a few million casualties every year I think.

So it is probably best to take no idea for granted and think hard yourself about every single one. And of course experiment, see whether it works.
I think that percamulture is a very good idea for instance and also the milk paint.

All the best,
John


Very much appreciation for these technical details. I bet my grandfather
knew how to do this but it's on the list of things he didn't teach my
father who of course was then unable to teach me. My maybe he did teach
my father but my father decided to just not pass it on. My father's
ambition is that I would not be a farmer, so there were lots of things
he didn't teach me that I wish I knew now.

Bob Waldrop

On 7/19/2012 3:27 PM, John D'hondt wrote:
No, Bob, the whey is surplus for that is where most of the acidity is found.
And acid and lime are not a good combination. It is not all that critical
though. Hydrated lime is highly alkaline and able to take a little acid. We
poor sufficiently sour milk through a cotton pillow casing. That can drip
for 24 hours or longer and we don't wait that long unless we want to make
cheese. Soft cottage cheese is about the right consistency. Add at least as
much volume lime and mix it up then dilute with some water if necessary.

We have found this hard wearing on timber and concrete and we also use it on
living apple trees where the bark is under attack by bark cancer fungus.
Even on the growing apple trees it is persistent for at least two years and
on concrete for at least 6-7 years in our wet climate. Regular white wash
with just lime and water needs to be replaced every year or sooner here.

I did not invent this. I read about it in some old book ages ago and had to
try it out. Sorry I can't give you any online references off hand. And I was
pleased with the results. It is not as white as regular white wash but that
was no problem for us. And also we have enough milk here to make that not a
problem. And hydrated lime is still a common building material here.

All the best,
John in Ireland


This is interesting. Do we want only the whey, or is the whole soured
milk workable? Or should I find some casein powder and add that? Do you
also add water too, or is it strictly lime plus soured milk?

I appreciate the tip.

Bob Waldrop, OKC

On 7/18/2012 6:14 PM, John D'hondt wrote:
Another version might be lime + milk (actually early cottage cheese, milk
gone sour that is releasing the whey. What you need is caseine) We have
found this very hard wearing and heavy-rain resistant as lime and water
is
definitely not.
john

We had several last-minute glitches we have not gotten this
done. The first problems were rain, as we had an unusually wet June.
Then we had a hard time actually finding hydrated (slaked) lime. None of
the usual suspects I had access to (Lowes, Home Despot, Ace Hardware)
stock it anymore. I have now tracked down some (from a tack shop) and
will do a fence and then we will see about doing the roof. I am doing
the fence first to try out two or three different formulations for
whitewash, as there are lots of recipes out there. I am going to try one
version that is only lime and water, another with some salt added, a
third with salt added plus letting it sit overnight before using it. A
chemist friend says that the effect of the added salt and letting it sit
is to make it easier to apply, but the cost is some of the whiteness.
So we will try a fence before we do the whole roof.

Bob Waldrop, OKC

On 7/18/2012 10:05 AM, Ken Morneault wrote:
Hi Bob,

Any feedback on the performance of the whitewash yet?

Regards,

Ken



________________________________
From: Bob Waldrop <bwaldrop@cox.net>
To: ROE2 <runningonempty2@yahoogroups.com>; permaculture
<permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 9:34 PM
Subject: [permaculture] Whitewash Bob's Roof Day plus Mapping/data site
find story on white roofs impacts

Whitewash Bob’s Roof Day is coming up June 2, 2012, this is a free
workshop at my house in OKC, where we will whitewash my roof.

For info on the benefits of white roofs, see . . .

http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Cooling/WhiteRoofExperiment/WhiteRoof.htm

For info on the whitewashing of roofs, a very cheap way to get a white
roof, see. . .

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/design/2012/04/just-fraction-more-white-roofs-could-have-huge-global-impact/1764/

There’s also a thread in the archives of this group from last year.

Anyone in the neighborhood is welcome to stop by. Let me know you’re
coming by email to bwaldrop@cox.net or by signing up with the FB event,
https://www.facebook.com/events/286135491467827/ .

I am also participating in an experiment that will apply a non-toxic
coating after the whitewash has cured. The goal is to extend the life
of
the whitewash from 2-3 years to 8-9 years.

A full report will be written and posted.

Bob Waldrop, OKC
https://www.facebook.com/prairierosepermaculture




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