permaculture

[Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com>]

I hear you Jonathan, in some cases if a person is violent, they may need to 
be sedated but let's find out why they might be acting that way. 
Sedatives are much milder than Seroquel and that whole class of drugs 
(antipsychotics) which will all cause brain damage over long term use. And 
many other physical problems including heart attacks, Tardive Dyskenesia 
(involuntary twitching), and much else - a very long list. 
One client died from Serequel - she was having an allergic reaction and was 
wrongly diagnosed and put on Serequel and had a heart attack. 
Another client I handled was a 10 year old boy who had smashed up his room 
with a hammer after his dad died. It was his way of expressing grief. He was 
involuntarily committed, and then tied down in five point restraints and 
allowed to pee on himself, when he panicked and went even more crazy after 
they forcibly removed him from his mother. He was let out ten days later on 
18 medications. Eighteen!! He was a drooling idiot. Then his mother, who 
believed that her son might be at risk of hurting himself and who trusted the 
Doctor's authority and expertise, realized that she needed to find out what 
really happened and started asking her son questions. It took a while to get 
it out of him, he was scared out of his mind he would be put back in there. 
Then they tried to commit him again against his mother's wishes which is when 
she called an advocate. I'm not even getting into the really sick parts, some 
of them in his medical records. His story made me cry
 and dry wretch. It is not the only one by any means, there are far too many, 
especially involving kids and elderly and otherwise vulnerable people. 
I know it is hard to care for people who are trying to harm themselves and 
others especially if it persists.  One of the most successful programs ever 
for "psychotics" (70% cure rate, very high rate) was a psychiatrist who had a 
big garden in the back of the facility and let his patients do what they 
wanted back there. That was it, that was the "treatment." Not surprising to 
me. Those places are so grim, most of them, not conducive to recovery - not 
much advanced from Bedlam. Nowdays, "garden therapy" is recognized as a 
mainstream therapy. Might even be covered under insurance payments. So there 
are some bright spots.
Cory

--- On Fri, 12/17/10, Jonathan Storvick <jstorvick@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Jonathan Storvick <jstorvick@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Social permaculture - mental health issues
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Friday, December 17, 2010, 12:20 PM

I agree that, as a whole, the use of psychotropic drugs in treating mental
illness needs to be critically examined and rethought.  However, as someone
who has spent some time in caring for individuals with mental illness, I
believe that the judicious use of these medications can play a beneficial
role in improving the quality of life of some individuals.

A couple of years ago, I worked at a group home where the teenaged residents
fit the multiple categories of developmental disabilities, psychiatric
disorders, violent behavior, and violently aggressive sexualized behavior.
On the occasions when some of the residents clandestinely stopped taking
their meds (which were everything from Haldol to Seroquel and everything in
between), there were exponential increases in violent behavior and assaults
on other residents and on staff - I bear a bite scar on my arm as a result
of one of these incidents.  During these episodes, and from talking to the
residents in question afterwards, it was apparent that the individual was
extremely unhappy, and felt worse because they had stopped taking their
medication.

I certainly do not believe that these drugs are a cure-all solution, or that
they should be the first (or last) solution, and especially that they should
not be used simply as a means of keeping individuals docile.  I do think,
however, that in some cases the judicious use of these drugs can be
beneficial.  They are a tool in the kit, so to speak, that can be properly
used when called for.  If there are alternatives that work, they should
certainly be investigated and used when appropriate.  I'll be checking out
this site with much interest.

Cheers,

Jon



On Fri, Dec 17, 2010 at 2:36 PM, Cory Brennan <cory8570@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I briefly advocated for mental health patients and foster care kids on
> psychiatric drugs and just helped a friend recently who was having severe
> side effects from a psych drug, and I felt compelled to share this with the
> group. When I worked in that field, I saw many many instances of the side
> effects from the drugs being worse than the mental symptoms they were
> supposed to help. Some of the drugs cause permanent brain damage, for
> instance - well documented in the medical studies.
> I feel the legal drug cartel is part of the overall problem we are trying
> to solve - there are more iatrogenic (caused by medication or other
> treatment) illnesses than many of the top diseases. And we have the whole
> environmental toxicity situation. I understand that not all medical drugs
> are bad and some are quite life saving, and for many, the side effects are
> worth it, and I acknowledge that. But there are some serious corruption
> issues that I feel need to be looked at.
> We worked on getting one law implemented in California that requires mental
> health professionals to ensure a thorough physical examination is done
> before diagnosing for mental illness. That is because, per study, so many
> mental symptoms have underlying physical cases - we found lupus, a broken
> back (i kid you NOT - the pain was driving the person crazy), typhoid, heavy
> metal poisoning, candida, vitamin and mineral deficiencies and you name it -
> when it was treated with alternative medicine (usually, except the broken
> back), the mental symptoms disappeared.
> The mental health industry has many scurvy elements to it (I've been there
> and seen it, some of it made me truly sick), and they are owned by Big
> Pharma which is so corrupt it is almost unbelievable, totally in bed with
> big oil, big ag, Halliburton, etc.
> There are alternatives which align a lot more with permaculture design,
> that address real causes (including environmental), and show more thorough
> people care.  This is one of them. Please, if someone you know is having
> serious emotional or mental difficulties, consider alternatives.
> http://www.alternativementalhealth.com/
> Cory
>
>
>
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>From kelly@bouldersustainability.org  Fri Dec 17 18:53:41 2010
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Lawrence - I take issue with this post.  You are the moderator of this
list serve and in my opinion this post demeans your efforts and your
role.  I completely understand and support your right to your opinion
and your own emotional response to any and all events, but this post
comes across  - in public -  as childish, immature and volatile and
only serves your critics.   Changing someone's email address to
"another moron" is clearly expressing your opinion,  but it is also
insulting and immature.  Casting the events at SSE in such a partisan,
personal way, whatever the truth of the matter, detracts from your
points, in my opinion.  It just brands you as an emotional hot head
and whatever message you are intending is lost.

If you need to vent your spleen, please do so in other ways.  I would
certainly appreciate your thinking more clearly about your role as the
moderator, and what "moderator" means.  Joining one side of an issue
and preventing other points of view from being expressed isn't usually
considered moderating by most people.  Some might call it the bully
pulpit.

Finally, generally keeping a member of the list serve from posting a
contrary point of view from yours, is self serving and crass.  It goes
against the agreements you have already made about when folks will be
banned and about open discussion.

I think you can  do better and I am asking you to consider it.

Thanks for listening.

Kelly


On Dec 15, 2010, at 12:11 AM, Lawrence F. London, Jr. wrote:

>
> On 12/14/2010, somemoron posting controversial private email wrote:
>> From: anothermoron@aol.com  Sent: Tuesday,
>> December 14, 2010 11:25 PM
>> Followup re permaculture list serve
>> to prevent my posting an url so members could read Seed
>> Saver's Exchange's side of the Kent Whealy story, so I contacted some
>> of the list members directly, to tell them that and give them the
>
> You know, I grow vegetables for market, sustainably,
> permaculturally. I depended on what used to be SSE. My beginnings in
> the world of natural agriculture coincided with Kent Whealy's SSE.
> People like me thought we could count on such a magnificent seed
> resource for many decades to come. But not so, as it was stolen from
> Kent by slimy corporate ag surrogates through a hostile internal
> coup by all the wrong folks on the SSE board of directors. There
> aren't but just so many grassroots seed preservation organizations
> that serve the sustainable farming community. When one of the larger
> ones gets stolen, coopted and put under the control of conventional,
> chemical, gmo-biotech agribusiness, that represents a great loss for
> our country's small farmers preserving traditional natural farming
> methods who need reliable sources of open pollinated heirloom seeds.
> _______________________________________________
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