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  • From: Patrick <forgeadams@yahoo.com>
  • To: permaculture listserve <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: [permaculture] Movement thinking (was Designing a Movement)
  • Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 22:57:28 -0700 (PDT)

Laurence said-As opposed to the old age hippy trippy (naturally, preferably)
back to
the land eco-ag-permacultural homestead types? You know, all those tens
of thousands who did this and constituted the foundation of the
homesteading, natural agriculture and permaculture revolution and
movement giving us most of what we have and enjoy today. Maybe the new
age types will consult with the old guard and experience an epiphany,
new vigor and greater enthusiasm.

Pardon me you old crank, I'm referring a totally different stripe of folks
than you're rambling on about. I get cynical being in Berkeley. It's full of
cults of every sort. Some of them push permaculture.

The 70's homesteading self publishing is near and dear to me, stuff like
Lloyd Khan, the New Alchemists, the Whole Earth Catalog, Christopher
Alexander & the Foxfire series. I am somewhat familiar with the giants who's
shoulders we stand upon. My partner's parents lived that lifestyle, they
still do to a certain extent but their once voluntary poverty is no longer
optional.





>From k.skvorak@gmail.com Thu Aug 19 16:58:20 2010
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Subject: Re: [permaculture] Movement thinking (was Designing a, Movement)
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Me too Toby,

I must say i emphatically disagree here as well (and am myself surprised at
the bias that seems to still peek thru even in your explanation):



On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 9:39 PM, Smith Mill Creek
<smithmillcreek@gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi Toby-
> I think I disagree on a number of points (which surprises me).
>
>>
>> From: Toby Hemenway<toby@patternliteracy.com>
>> "If we look at permaculture as a movement, it's in the quite left-wing,
>> Earth-worshipping, hippie-descended, middle and upper middle class, etc,
>> etc, region, with a modest number of outliers included. A narrow slice. Who
>> else would even be arguing about working with the army?
>>
>
Toby c'mon now- you are honestly asking: " who else would be arguing about
working with the US military?"

you really want anyone to answer that for you? how about relatives of the
millions & millions, literally, of folks killed by US forces in the last
40yrs. Few of them hippies, i imagine.

i mean, cmon now....

best,
kevin




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