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  • From: "John Schinnerer" <john@eco-living.net>
  • To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] Can language be recycled?
  • Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 11:29:20 -0700 (PDT)

Aloha,

> I was using the word "defend" in the sense it is used when talking about
> debates, conversation, "defending a point" etc. I'm not trying to get
> defensive here, but if you have a proposal for another word I'm ready to
> hear it.

I think my actual question is about the root of "defend." Webster says:

"Etymology: Middle English, from Old French 'defendre', from Latin
'defendere', from de- + -fendere to strike; akin to Old English 'guth'
battle, war, Greek 'theinein' to strike"

So "defend" appears to be rooted in conflict/competition rather than
cooperation.

When you ask:

> > How would the fair marketplaces defend themselves from
> > the free market we currently have?

It appears to me that your question about defense begs the question of an
attack - that is, an attack is implicit, is assumed. How much does our
languaging contribute to self-fulfilling prophecy?

What if we asked something like "how can we design 'fair marketplaces'
that will become preferred systems for just and peaceful exchange of goods
and services amongst diverse peoples?"

> I don't follow your propaganda point however. I'm formulating questions
> and statements about economic and social systems.
> Is your point that I cannot use the terms "capitalism" and "democracy"
> without falling into the pitfalls of propaganda?

No - perhaps not without falling into the pitfalls of our languaging,
though. When I read "capitalism" I know only my own story about what that
is, and perhaps some others I'm familiar with. I don't really know the
ultimate particulars of the system you're referring to. Do you mean
"capitalism" when used as an equivalent word for "democracy," or
"capitalism" as defined by Marx, or "capitalism" as defined by George II
(King or President, take your pick... ;-)?

That's why I'm suggesting avoiding the overloaded buzzwords ("terms") and
getting specific with parameters, descriptions, details, etc. (I suppose I
ought to avoid using 'etc.' then too... ;-)

That by itself would be "culture jamming" in a culture that makes such
heavy use of buzzwords, buzzphrases, 'sound bites' and oversimplification
of complex systems.



John Schinnerer, MA
-------------------------
- Eco-Living -
Cultural & Ecological Designing
People - Place - Learning - Integration
john@eco-living.net
http://eco-living.net




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