pcplantdb

[Chad Knepp <pyg@galatea.org>]

Lawrence F. London, Jr. writes:
 > Chad Knepp wrote:
 > 
 > >   o John H.: Can we start with your box, at least until things get
 > >   more settled? 
 > 
 > I would say that there _may_ be a better than average chance that
 > ibiblio will be able to offer Zope to the project. I was encouraged
 > by my conversation with Paul.
 > 
 > He asked that someone from our group email his staff
 > (help@ibiblio.org) with the Zope request and how much disk storage
 > we will need. I would urge whoever is going to do this to follow up
 > now rather than later.
 > John Howe wrote:
 > --------------
 > > If we do end up using your server, we could write that into the
 > next grant.  If it is decided to use my server for the time being,
 > I currently see it as an environment towards the enventual
 > succession to ibiblio.  Systemically, I see use of my server as
 > "proving ground" to system requirments @ ibiblio
 > eventually. johncompanies.com is also Open Source friendly, and I
 > get reduced rates when hosting open source projects.
 > 
 > I do see the project eventually residing at ibiblio. I think in the
 > interim prototype phases, I have available hosting resources that
 > can address the development effort. And funding could be pursued to
 > acquire the necessary dedicated server resources @ ibiblio in the
 > next grant phases.
 > --------------
 > > John H. - as your time permits, would you take this on?
 > > You have afaik by far the most hands-on experience of any of us for
 > > informing the ibiblio folks what we/they need in terms of hosting
 > > resources and config for zope.
 > 
 > Can do, should have something in place by the end of next week. My
 > thinking is tracking the development for a while, we can procure
 > some metrics ( cpu, memory, bandwidth, diskspace ) of what the
 > application will require as it scales.
 > <><>
 > 
 > So, has John H. contacted them or if not could he do so soon or
 > have Chad or John S. do this?

Hey John or John are you on this?  If not I'll talk to them.  I think
for numbers we could say something like disk use starting at 100 Megs
and hoping to grow to 1 Gig and bandwidth starting at 1-5 Gigs/month
and hoping to grow to 10-20 Gigs/month.  No idea about CPU usage but I
don't think it will be that significant.  These are really wild
guesses until we have something developed

 > If you will find out once and for all whether you will have Zope on
 > ibiblio you can then select your development platform and move on
 > with work. It sounds like the only and best hosting choice is
 > ibiblio. If Zope isn't going to be possible then use Eden or MySQL;
 > the advantage of the latter is that we might be able to begin
 > accumulating resources in HG and have something to show the public,
 > all of which would help get more funding from grant sources.
 > 
 > > Plan realated stuff:
 > > 
 > > So nobody really responded to my emails regarding the fact that 1) I
 > > need additional time to learn Zope and 2) I really only can commit to
 > > 30 hours a week.  This definitely puts a skew on the Project Plan, and
 > > I'd like some feedback.  According to the plan I am scheduled to
 > 
 > That is definitely Stephanie's department.
 > 
 > > Zope cons: 
 > >   o Big learning curve.
 > >   o Unknown performance (speed).
 > > 
 > > Zope pros:
 > >   o Lots of built in tools.
 > >   o Supports OO data model.
 > 
 > I'd say it would be a good idea to determine if it is really going
 > to work for you before asking ibiblio to install it for HG.
 > 
 > > Eden cons:
 > >   o No built in tools except for the current engine.
 > >   o Table based data model.
 > > 
 > > Eden pros:
 > >   o Known high performance.
 > >   o Quick start w/existing code.
 > 
 > It's up to the programmers but I vote for getting going sooner with
 > Eden or MySQL; you would have Richard onboard with greater ease
 > with this option.
 > 
 > > My take and I think John^2's is that Zope is the better choice.  It
 > > will probably take more time to get going with it, but with all the
 > > built in tools and packages available it will probably save time in
 > > the long run.  Although I don't know how it will perform I'm pretty
 > > confident that we can optimize performance bottlenecks as we go along.
 > > We can in fact use MySQL (or another RDBMS) as the storage backend to
 > > ZODB if FileStorage isn't fast enough or becomes unscaleable.
 > 
 > This sounds great but please contact ibiblio about ZOPE rsn.
 > 
 > > Something I hope you consider putting in this post is emphasizing the
 > > commitment the group (or parts of the group) has to the long term
 > > vision of creating an all encompassing knowledge base of permaculture
 > > information... and that this knowledge will have connecting
 > > information about how the elements of this knowledge relate to each
 > > other.  Something about how it's going to be more than plants anyway.
 > 
 > If it is done on ibiblio I can be counted on to help out in a
 > variety of ways for the long haul.  I plan to focus more of my
 > attention on HG than on any other web projects I work on, now or
 > later.

I have a high degree of confidence that ibiblio will be able to
provide what we need regarding a zope platform, even if it isn't right
away.  We also have the expertise between us to do it ourselves or
help them do it for us.  Zope really is common/popular enough to be
available almost everywhere.  I am a little surprised that they don't
have an install there already, but it's no big deal.  Anyway, I don't
think that the fact that ibiblio doesn't already have Zope should be a
big factor in deciding whether to go the Zope route or the Eden/MySQL
route.

-- 
Chad Knepp
python -c 'import base64;print base64.decodestring("cHlnQGdhbGF0ZWEub3Jn")'