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- From: Karen Tillou <arboretum@homeorchardsociety.org>
- To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
- Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs
- Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 12:59:46 -0700
i have so many questions and sidelines that pertain to this/these subjects, i don't even know where to begin: disclaimer: i live in oregon; no curculio, little fireblight, no summer humidity, etc. i've never grown fruit back east, though i grew up in buffalo NY. i also believe oil is just going to get scarcer and scarcer. the thing i love about nafex is that it is a group for commercial and backyard growers alike. this is an issue that to me comes down amidst those professional/amateur lines: who out there in the east is successfully growing organic fruit? are you in your backyard, or big-time commercial, or inbetween, taking fruit to a farmer's market or restaurant when you have it... what is successful fruit? does it mean no bugs, or does it mean enough bug free fruit to have some for storage and eating out of hand, enough wormy but ok fruit for canning/drying, and enough wormy/scabby fruit to juice with and make cider with too? does it mean some years are boom and some are bust? what are the bug tolerances for you smaller commercial growers - can/do you sell buggy/scabby seconds to home canners at the farmers markets? is it legal to sell juice made with a wormy apple (wormy but sound; not rotting, of course...)? i like a lot what rivka said the economics of organic growers, and what the cornell study did (or did not) assume with regards to spray programs. i think the universities and extensions are somewhat locked into the conventional model of spray regimes, and don't always take into account the multi-pronged approach of good organic growing. i think it invites me as an organic grower to look very critically at a university study saying it isn't cost effective. maybe it isn't cost effective from a conventional standpoint, selling to the middleman who ships it to place X, 2000 miles away, but is it cost effective when you are selling direct to your customers, integrating a lot of techniques for pest/disease control, and not putting all your hopes into one basket (apples), but managing a diverse farm/multiple crops? so many of the old-time cultural and mechanical ways of controlling bugs/diseases from pre-WWII are really labor intensive, but are they worth it on the small scale? someone mentioned bagging as totally worth their labor dollars (was it jim?) - is anyone doing the wacky knocking curculio out onto tarps? is that worth the time? running animals under trees for june drop control, windfalls, larvae overwinterers? we bag here for scab and the codling moth and apple maggot, but i have yet to introduce animals (poultry or pigs) into the orchard as it is on public proerty, i don't live there, i'm not there every day, etc. someday, i hope to work that concept into an orchard. thinking out loud, karen oregon city, OR - zone 8a and wet On Apr 13, 2008, at 2:48 PM, Road's End Farm wrote: Hi Dennis, |
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[NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
dmnorton, 04/09/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Karen Tillou, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Mark & Helen Angermayer, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Mark & Helen Angermayer, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/15/2008
- Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs, Mark & Helen Angermayer, 04/15/2008
- Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs, Bob Randall, 04/15/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/15/2008
- Re: [NAFEX] Flavor was Organic vs Standard Spray Programs, Betty Mayfield, 04/17/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Mark & Helen Angermayer, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/14/2008
- Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs, Road's End Farm, 04/14/2008
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[NAFEX] organic fruit in the East?,
Donna &/or Kieran, 04/17/2008
- [NAFEX] Insect ID Help, Scott Williamson, 04/18/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Mark & Helen Angermayer, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Karen Tillou, 04/14/2008
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Re: [NAFEX] Organic vs Standard Spray Programs,
Road's End Farm, 04/14/2008
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